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GoatLord

25th anniversary project proposal

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"Proposal" is the key word here. I've never organized a project and in fact am still working on releasing my first map, so I would rather someone with experience carry out this idea, or perhaps it will inspire an even better project. So here goes:

 

25 maps, for Doom 2, by 25 different authors. It would be split into 5 minisodes, each one covering a different era in the franchise. Each minisode would use textures from its respective era; although, for the sake of simplicity, the weapons and enemies would remain the same throughout.

1-5 = Doom 1/Doom 2

6-10 = Final Doom/PSX Doom

11-15= Doom 64

16-20 = Doom 3

21-25 = Doom '16

 

This would require a lot of work in terms of resources, especially with Doom 3 and Doom '16. I believe someone is at least working on a Doom 3 texture set, but I don't know if any progress has been made for '16. I don't think every single texture from those games (especially the new one) would need to be converted, but a few hundred from each would be nice. Whether or not it should be vanilla-compatible is difficult to tackle. I think that, given how many options you get with UDMF—in particular colored lighting and more tagging options/specials, which will be great for the 3rd, 4th and 5th minisodes—the project could be really diverse and clean looking, without requiring Doomsday, GZDoom or some standalone source port. A UDMF mapset seems like it would be the most overall compatible.

 

The first couple of minisodes would be very "traditional" in their layouts, but the third would get a bit more complex, and then 4 and 5 could get very liberal with features. The idea is that the mapset becomes increasingly complex, but is persistently set in a "classic" Doom universe. As for secret maps...I think it would be very interesting if every minisode had a secret map, and that map would be some kind of homage to the minisode's setting. For instance, A Doom 1/2 minisode secret map might combine the Bruiser Bros. fight in E1M8 with some kind of Nazi theme ala Map 31/32. A Final/PSX Doom secret map could perhaps have a Club Doom vibe with a bit of Wormhole or another highly iconic Final Doom map.

 

So that's my proposal. I absolutely cannot and will not spearhead the project, because of a lack of experience. Any thoughts?

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I like this idea, i would love to contribute a doom 3 style map if this plan goes on, D3 textures could also be used for the D16 maps

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25 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

1-5 = Doom 1/Doom 2

6-10 = Final Doom/PSX Doom

11-15= Doom 64

16-20 = Doom 3

21-25 = Doom '16

Why is Doom 1 and 2 lumped together? Why is Final Doom its own category AND lumped together with PSX Doom? Why is PSX Doom even wasting mapslots here? Why no Jaguar Doom slots? Why 5 entire slots for D64? Do you seriously think 5 good Doom 3 maps can be cranked out at all, by 5 different people nonetheless? Are D44M slots just be codes to snapmaps?

 

30 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

So that's my proposal. I absolutely cannot and will not spearhead the project, because of a lack of experience. Any thoughts?

...

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"Hey, I'd really like to play this mod that might not even be possible and would take a ton of effort from everyone else, would you guys go and make it for me?  Oh, and I'm going to claim that your work was my idea."

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2 hours ago, GoatLord said:

25 maps, for Doom 2, by 25 different authors. It would be split into 5 minisodes, each one covering a different era in the franchise. Each minisode would use textures from its respective era; although, for the sake of simplicity, the weapons and enemies would remain the same throughout.

1-5 = Doom 1/Doom 2

6-10 = Final Doom/PSX Doom

11-15= Doom 64

16-20 = Doom 3

21-25 = Doom '16

I actually really like this as a concept - making something that spans the whole history of Doom as a game and paying respect to each part, with some kind of overarching story to tie it all together. A few thoughts though:

 

Firstly, the difficulty in making levels for eg. Doom vs. Doom 3 is significantly different. Even making one level for Doom 3 is a lot of work, and you might struggle nowadays to find enough people even interested in mapping for Doom 3. I would abandon the "5 per minisode" idea, divide the project into sub-teams focused on a particular game and have them just make what they can. For example maybe the split is that there are 20 classic Doom levels but there's only one or two Doom 3 levels. 

 

Probably ditch the idea of Final Doom or PSX Doom being something separate and distinct. Instead perhaps make an episode replacement for Doom 1 and a small mini-episode for Doom 2 (maybe 10 levels for example).

 

It would be nice if the classic Doom levels paid homage to the history of Doom mapping in some way. Inject some creativity and humor and you could do this in a really nice way.

 

The Doom 2016 portion presumably means SnapMap. I assume you can make single player levels with it? (for some reason I thought it was just for making deathmatch levels). I'm not familiar with how flexible it is or the full extent of what people have been able to put together with it.

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2 hours ago, Linguica said:

Goatlord, before you start asking for help on your new mega-cool-and-whatnot project, make sure you have something to show first (screenshots, map downloads, etc). Keep in mind we've already seen thousands of upcoming projects that actually never got done.

Hey, this is just an idea. Also, I've seen this exact same message about 3 times. :D 

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Yeah, I think a few of you may have failed to realize that I'm not asking anyone to do this, I'm just throwing it out there in the pool of ideas. If someone wants to run with it, great. I would actually participate by contributing a map for sure. I'm not here to beg for a free prize, it's just a suggestion that someone might feel inspired by if they feel so inclined.

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3 hours ago, dew said:

Why is Doom 1 and 2 lumped together? Why is Final Doom its own category AND lumped together with PSX Doom? Why is PSX Doom even wasting mapslots here? Why no Jaguar Doom slots? Why 5 entire slots for D64?

because it's not your project idea.

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1 hour ago, fraggle said:

Even making one level for Doom 3 is a lot of work, and you might struggle nowadays to find enough people even interested in mapping for Doom 3. I would abandon the "5 per minisode" idea, divide the project into sub-teams focused on a particular game and have them just make what they can. For example maybe the split is that there are 20 classic Doom levels but there's only one or two Doom 3 levels. 

This mod would be created entirely with Doom 2 in mind. I'm not talking about Doom 3 maps, but Doom 3-esque maps within the constrains of UDMF.

1 hour ago, fraggle said:

Probably ditch the idea of Final Doom or PSX Doom being something separate and distinct. Instead perhaps make an episode replacement for Doom 1 and a small mini-episode for Doom 2 (maybe 10 levels for example).

The idea is to avoid repetition by having various themes. Final Doom and PSX Doom have some unique textures and, given PSX Doom's lighting, it could contrast quite nicely with the more traditional maps proceeding it.

 

1 hour ago, fraggle said:

The Doom 2016 portion presumably means SnapMap. I assume you can make single player levels with it? (for some reason I thought it was just for making deathmatch levels). I'm not familiar with how flexible it is or the full extent of what people have been able to put together with it.

I'm not sure if you read the entire proposal; everything would be made in Doom 2. Like with Doom 3, the last mapset would be Doom '16-esque maps. These present a challenge mostly in that there are, as of my understanding, currently no Doom 2-friendly paletted sets for these games.

 

Oh, and @dew, you were asking about why the mapsets were suggested in the manner they were. To me each minisode would have its own look and feel. Doom 1 and 2 are largely similar looking; Final Doom and PSX Doom have unique graphics and in the case of the latter, extra graphical details and dark ambient music; Doom 64 has a completely unique texture set in addition to its PSX-like adornments. I think these games are unique enough that each minisode would have a distinct personality.

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Nah, doom1 and doom2 have vastly different beastiaries, locales, level design and atmospheres to them. 

 

 

on the subject of the project itself, why propose this idea if you're not going to take action in it, as far as community projects go i can't visualize this blowing over well without some heavy improvements. i like the idea of a 25th-anniversary project but i'd do it terms of 25 years of the community itself, not just 25 years of the game. so like someone said in another thread, have the first few maps be full of 1994-isms, have it slowly 'progress' as the years go on. etc....

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(but of course if you manage to make it work, then well i've been wronged and you're welcome to hate on me all you want. this is just my pessimistic self)

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I agree it was a bit short-sighted to just blurt out an idea. I guess I'm just interested in conversation about a possibility. Maybe it may inspire something I feel I could actually spearhead. As I said, no one has to do anything with this.

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The idea once got kicked around here about getting the old masters (or those that are still alive) to put together a megawad with each of them contributing 1 or 2 maps. Perhaps the 25th anniversary would be the time to try to make this idea a reality.

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Well there still is the possibility of a community mapping project where only STARTAN and FIRBLU is used with d_runnin. I think that is worthy of 25 years anniversary.

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my first map


You did release your first map :/ which was one hell of a E1M1 remake IIRC. I know there're sector trains at the exit.

====

IDK how some of you thought he was actually talking about making actual Doom 64 maps via Doom 64 EX, Doom 3 maps (Doom 3 Phobos still hasn't been released. Just imagine the work it takes to make a Doom 3 mod/map), or Doom 2016 SnapMaps. All I saw was Doom-esque maps in ZDoom-based ports

We already have Doom1/2 textures, so that's settled.

We have a Doom 64 texture pack thanks to Nevander (looking forwards to the next version of Doom 64 Retribution :DDD)

We have a mostly-finished Doom 3 texture pack, so Doom 3-esque maps are possible, along with Doom 2016-esque maps. Let's face it, both games have similar techy textures.

If this project wants to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Doom (gosh I'm not even 20) then it has to be spectacular, but there's only 2 months left till the anniversary. I'd like to see something a bit more different rather a mapset. Like some minor gameplay modifications along with maps.

That's just me.

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11 hours ago, Voros said:

If this project wants to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Doom (gosh I'm not even 20) then it has to be spectacular, but there's only 2 months left till the anniversary. I'd like to see something a bit more different rather a mapset. Like some minor gameplay modifications along with maps.

That's just me.

The 24th anniversary is coming up. 25 is still over a year away. ;-)

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I would LOVE to chip-in on DooM 3! Being that its my favourite in the series and DooM is almost 25, I'd happily lend a hand! (Though I will need sprites/items/textures since I'm not that good outside of cartoony graphics.) Hell even if I don't get to make the maps I'd happily play-test...

 

 

 

That or I'll review it. Plz make this happen @w@

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The secret levels, Levels 31 and 32, should be a combination of other games that use the Doom engine, such as Heretic, Hexen, Strife, Chex Quest, Hacx, etc...  

 

Maybe restrict the secret levels only to Heretic, Hexen, and Strife?

Edited by Master O

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