Has anyone ever tried using "Oblique Strategies" for mapping?

[Jon]

Has anyone ever tried using Oblique Strategies for mapping?

 

Oblique Strategies is a deck of cards designed by Brian Eno and Peter Schmidt for attempting to resolve "creative dilemmas". They contain seemingly cryptic sentences and phrases like "Try faking it!" and "Honour thy error as a hidden intention.", which might serve to make sense in the context of an artistic road-block or dead-end and might help you to move forward. They have been successfully used by a swathe or artists, mostly musicians, including Eno himself (obviously) but also notably Coldplay, REM, and David Bowie. They are still available to buy, and alternate digital versions exist, including an iOS version and a website.

 

It only recently occurred to me that they might be useful when mapping. I haven't tried them for this purpose myself, but if I ever map again I think I will do so.

 

Similar are the Intùiti Creative Cards by Matteo di Pascale. These are much more abstract and I haven't spent much time with them yet.

Edited November 6, 2017 by Jon : expand

[Jon]

Bump, original post was a quick phone thing, I've expanded it and explained what I'm on about.

[Memfis]

These seem really cool!

 

"Make what's perfect more human" <- many modern mappers are yet to learn this one...

[therektafire]

Some of the advices on Oblicard were honestly shit lol. "Call your mother and ask her what to do", "get a neck massage", "you can only make one dot at a time". How am I supposed to make a map while getting my neck massaged and my mom doesn't know shit about Doom mapping so she won't be much help and obviously I can only make one dot at a time, that's literally what mapping for doom is, putting down dots then connecting them to make sectors then texturing and stuff like that, so that isn't particularly helpful either :D

 

On the other hand I did see some pretty good ones though, of course mixed in with some cliche motivational quotes for good measure. Not sure I would use this for mapping though, I would rather use something like jmickles random theme generator to get ideas, in fact I did this in the past when practicing for eagle 7

[Spie812]

"Do nothing for as long as possible"

 

Pfft, that's my mapping strategy anyway

[Jon]

It serves a completely different purpose to jmickle's excellent theme generator. The two are not incompatible. 

[Memfis]

Your mother doesn't know shit about Doom mapping, so her input will be very unique and not tainted by cliches, which is why it might be useful. And I don't think you're supposed to map during the massage. :D

[Vorpal]

I bought a set for a friend who was starting a business a few years back. But I always wonder if that was one of those "self gifts" where the other person looks at it once and shoves it in a drawer, while I secretly wish I had it.

[jmickle66666666]

The random theme generator^[1] i made is essentially my answer for Oblique Strategies for doom (or any worldbuilding exercise). Of course the point of the cards is to *not* be too specific to any medium, or even creating anything at all, because they are supposed to be interpreted and considered. But this mindset can still be taken with less oblique stuff. For instance if I get "A Ridge above The Flawless Badlands"; while I could just think about making a rough wasteland area with some high walkways, it might be more worthwhile to think about how that height contrast would make for a good strong aesthetic, and also possibly a gameplay progression (start off on the low ground, reach higher ground or vice versa), then expand that idea even more and capitalise on those new ideas til you have something cool to make. It doesn't have to *actually* be A Ridge above The Flawless Badlands, but that was still the genesis of the idea.

 

^[1] Much credit to alfonzo for 80% of the dictionary the generator uses, btw. He has spent a long time expanding it's vocabulary, resulting in a much more interesting and verbose tool, and many magnitudes more possible ideas.

[Gez]

"Ask your body" -- okay, gonna take a nap.

"Is the intonation correct?" -- I have no idea, honestly. I'd need to figure out what intonation means for a map.

"Tape your mouth" -- mmmmfff mffhh mhhhh fmrrmmmh

"Intentions -credibility of -nobility of -humility of" -- yeah, whatever

 

I guess that's not for me.

 

[Vorpal]

42 minutes ago, Gez said:

"Ask your body" -- okay, gonna take a nap.

"Is the intonation correct?" -- I have no idea, honestly. I'd need to figure out what intonation means for a map.

"Tape your mouth" -- mmmmfff mffhh mhhhh fmrrmmmh

"Intentions -credibility of -nobility of -humility of" -- yeah, whatever

 

I guess that's not for me.

 

Well, bringing your own brain is part of the equation. In programming it would be comparable to the random seed (the oblique strategy / jmickle generator "idea") before it gets passed through the algorithm (your mind's interpretation).

 

I know you don't care though since you're making an effort to isolate the weirder ones (with regards to mapping), when there's a vast glut of very fucking applicable 'strategies. 

[Jon]

6 hours ago, jmickle66666666 said:

The random theme generator^[1] i made is essentially my answer for Oblique Strategies for doom (or any worldbuilding exercise).

 

If I'm interpreting you correctly and you were inspired by the Oblique Strategies cards, that is really interesting to know, but I think they serve different purposes, and are complementary.

 

Your excellent theme generator I would use to help me come up with a theme at the start of mapping: for example, it might tell me to make a big fleshy spaceship in the shape of a cock and balls.

 

The cards would help me mid-mapping when I've hit some kind of creative wall. E.g. I can't figure out how to transition between the left and right balls. I draw a card (I'm literally drawing a card now), "Is it finished?" This could be interpreted to mean consider whether a transition between left and right ball was truly necessary.

 

Cock&BallsDM coming some time in 2018!

 

[Gez]

6 hours ago, Vorpal said:

I know you don't care though since you're making an effort to isolate the weirder ones (with regards to mapping), when there's a vast glut of very fucking applicable 'strategies. 

I have made zero effort. I went to oblicard.com, pasted the first thing I got, hit the refresh icon in the bottom left corner, pasted the new thing I got, and did that two more time. Those four lines are the exhaustive entirety of all the results I have gotten from oblicard, in the order I have gotten them. My approach was entirely neutral and I did not do any sort of selection or edition or other dishonest stuff to skew the results I have displayed. What You See Is What I Got, no more, no less.

[jmickle66666666]

The point of Oblique Strategies is to try and apply the card to what you're doing, not (necessarily) just take them at face value. For example let's take a common situation with a map: I'm struggling with how to expand my map, i've only got a small (but detailed and nicely flowing) area, but want to build more out but can't think where.

 

"Ask your body" -> maybe i can think about my state of mind? have i been sitting here for hours procrastinating and not making progress? maybe i need a break? or maybe we can think in an abstract way: how do bodies grow/expand? can i apply any ideas here?

 

"Is the intonation correct" -> Brian Eno did admit some of them were quite specific to music, and this is a prime example. However that doesn't mean we can't try. Intonation is something to do with fine-tuning instruments. The only real approach here would be abstract but here are two ideas: 1) I could spend some time balancing the gameplay of the area i currently have, to take my mind of building new areas for a bit. 2) Is the area i've built *too* tightly knit? Maybe some intentional destruction of what i've built can help spur new ideas.

 

"Tape your mouth" -> Not really gonna help in any literal sense (but it can for music!), but there are some semi-literal interpretations: Think about sound-blocking lines and potential interesting encounters that could be built with them, maybe think about an area that requires making no noise at all for fear of waking up monsters.

 

"Intentions -credibility of -nobility of -humility of" -> This is pretty directly saying 'how good are the ideas you currently have anyway?'. Maybe the reason i dont wanna knock down this specific wall is because i spent so long making it look nice!! maybe it doesn't actually look nice and it's just sunk cost fallacy?

 

 

Like, it isn't difficult to use these properly; you were right when you said you made zero effort, that's why you got zero result. 

 

I took the exact same 4 cards you did, applied them to a very common situation I face when mapping, and I got many potential solutions to my problem.

[Master O]

On 11/5/2017 at 6:22 AM, Jon said:

Has anyone ever tried using Oblique Strategies for mapping?

 

Oblique Strategies is a deck of cards designed by Brian Eno and Peter Schmidt for attempting to resolve "creative dilemmas". They contain seemingly cryptic sentences and phrases like "Try faking it!" and "Honour thy error as a hidden intention.", which might serve to make sense in the context of an artistic road-block or dead-end and might help you to move forward. They have been successfully used by a swathe or artists, mostly musicians, including Eno himself (obviously) but also notably Coldplay, REM, and David Bowie. They are still available to buy, and alternate digital versions exist, including an iOS version and a website.

 

It only recently occurred to me that they might be useful when mapping. I haven't tried them for this purpose myself, but if I ever map again I think I will do so.

 

Similar are the Intùiti Creative Cards by Matteo di Pascale. These are much more abstract and I haven't spent much time with them yet.

 

"Here Come the Warm Wads!"

 

"Another Green Wad"

 

"Paw Paw Negro Blowtorch Wad"

 

"Swastika Wads"

 

"Before and After Wads"

 

"Taking Wad Mountain by Strategy"

 

---

 

Quite honestly, doom levels inspired by Brian Eno's music could be very bizarre. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Master O

[Jon]

8 hours ago, Master O said:

"Another Green Wad"

 

Skillsaw would have to do MAP01.

[Master O]

17 hours ago, Jon said:

 

Skillsaw would have to do MAP01.

 

I guess "Swastika Wads" would be MAPS 31 and 32.

[NeedHealth]

So I am stuck in a bit of a map block right now. Let's see what OP's link will produce:

"Water"

could have worked but that's already half the doom map w i p and i am trying to introduce a setting change.

 

"Once the search has begun, something will be found"

... yeah.

 

"Accretion"

.. had to google this one. Not using.

 

"In total darkness, or in a very large room, very quietly"

... No comment.

 

Probably going to end up with the first one. Thanks !

 

one more:

 

"Magnify the most difficult details"

... .... this is like a mockery. I'm out.

[JPL]

Apologies for the necromancy, but yesterday I made this page - Oblique Stragies for Doom level designers - and remembered this thread.

 

I may add to the deck over time as I think of things. One notable divide is between prompts that are more explicitly architectural / structural, and prompts that are more about pacing, premise, scripting. And how those sometimes interact.

[elend]

That's a lovely thing. Saw it on Discord yesterday and already noted some stuff down for my map. Imho a really good way to kickstart your map or certain areas.

[Master O]

On a semi-related note, Brian Eno's 70s albums are classics, especially:

 

Here Come the Warm Jets

Taking Tiger Mountain by Strategy

Another Green World

Before and After Science

 

Any doom maps inspired by the above albums would certainly be interesting ones...