Duke Nukem 3D is depressing

[fraggle]

Don't think I've ever played with Duke Talk turned off before. It's kind of interesting that the tone of the game can be affected so much by that one feature.

[SyntherAugustus]

Honestly I like the game a lot more without Duke Talk and the babes. It makes for a very atmospheric game.

 

Lost Duke Episodes kind of capitalized on this concept and I wish other Duke3d levelsets did the same.

[reflex17]

When I made Duke maps my main project was with a dark sci-fi ambient vibe, and I remember being annoyed that the Duke Talk was a menu option and I had no control over it as a mapper. (I mean of course without .CON file editing, I only wanted to add new textures). It could be used to great effect though as sector tags that would make Duke say things, it made his personality stand out even more across the duration of the map.

 

It goes with the character though, even in the worst situations he cracks one-liners. The storyline is minimal being an early 90's FPS, but grim as all hell for what it is. "Taking the Death Toll" was like the D_RUNNIN of Duke, as the default music track for most custom maps, and I would deliberately not change it because of its ambience. Then folks would say I should change from the default music *shrugs* but yeah the original midi especially to me feels really bleak,,, that might just be a side effect of general midi tonality though hehehe. My favorite track from Duke3d is "Lord of L.A", composed by Bobby Prince as it turns out:

 

 

Lots of fiction uses comedy stuff and unsettling imagery side-by-side. It's like delivering the medicine with a little bit of sugar. World of Warcraft looks very cartoony for example but a lot of the quests and easter-eggs in the game are on the "rather disturbing" side, like ghost children and stuff like that.

 

 

Edited November 23, 2017 by reflex17

[Roofi]

I don't  know Duke NUkem very well , but this track is very spooky and depressing. It sounds like a music from a Resident Evil game.

 

But this also one of my favourites.

 

[reflex17]

16 hours ago, Piper Maru said:

I always liked this tune from the PSX version of Duke Nukem.

 

 

WOW> I've never played that version before, what an awesome song.

[NeedHealth]

What's the license on duke3d ? After reading this thread I want to go back and play it but my funds are minimal to be frank. I nearly completed the first episode as far as I remember ( this was more than a couple years ago).

[Decay]

Personally I thought the N64 version having no music playing at all lent a lot to the overall atmosphere. When I was a kid I thought the game was quite grim, I should revisit it someday.

[Da Werecat]

Pirated Half-Life with no music left a big impression on me. I was intrigued when I learned there was supposed to be music, but then I heard that upbeat techno when you grab the suit, and it just made me cringe. Though that was more of an exception, IIRC.

 

[reflex17]

18 minutes ago, NeedHealth said:

What's the license on duke3d ? After reading this thread I want to go back and play it but my funds are minimal to be frank. I nearly completed the first episode as far as I remember ( this was more than a couple years ago).

 

You can get Megaton Edition on GOG.com.

 

The latest steam version "Duke Nukem 3d 20th World Tour" has a new fifth episode designed by Allen Blum III and Richard "Levelord" Gray, the level designers from the original Duke3d, along with new music and Duke talk. I haven't played this one myself so I can't comment on what it's like.

 

DUKE3d.GRP is the file that is required to run the game with source ports like JonoF's original port or Eduke32.

[dsm]

The game instantly struck me as pretty depressing when I first tried it all the way back in '96 - it just gave me a feeling that all other men in the world were dead or mutated and all the non-babe women were dead too, and all the while, Duke is just coming across as a selfish, unfeeling asshole about it, cracking one-liners about how awesome he thinks he is.

I kinda had to get used to it :P

[Nevander]

I always wished there was an option to save the babes. Though I guess blowing them up is saving them from what horrible shit from the aliens comes next.

[Lila Feuer]

1 hour ago, Nevander said:

I always wished there was an option to save the babes. Though I guess blowing them up is saving them from what horrible shit from the aliens comes next.

Food!

[Hisymak]

Rather than depressing it was sometimes scary to me, when I was playing it as a kid. There were specific places which I was really afraid of and had problems to pass. The majority of them were in episode 2, of course.

The place which I was probably the most afraid of was the ending part of E2L8 (Dark Side) - the Monolith with an eerie sound playing around it which I was extremely frightened of, that was actually a teleport to a place full of octabrains and trapped astronauts. That scared me really well.

The other place was the ending room of E2L4 which was the first time I encountered an Assault Commander (playing on Easy). It was really big surprise to me and they killed me before I even attempted to shoot. I remember having a nightmare about that during the following night. Then for some time, it was always one of the hardest parts of game for me to pass.

Then I was always afraid of full E2L5 and E2L9 levels, as they were really hard, and I was very much scared of the E2 final boss.

[_bruce_]

8 hours ago, Hisymak said:

Rather than depressing it was sometimes scary to me, when I was playing it as a kid. There were specific places which I was really afraid of and had problems to pass. The majority of them were in episode 2, of course.

The place which I was probably the most afraid of was the ending part of E2L8 (Dark Side) - the Monolith with an eerie sound playing around it which I was extremely frightened of, that was actually a teleport to a place full of octabrains and trapped astronauts. That scared me really well.

The other place was the ending room of E2L4 which was the first time I encountered an Assault Commander (playing on Easy). It was really big surprise to me and they killed me before I even attempted to shoot. I remember having a nightmare about that during the following night. Then for some time, it was always one of the hardest parts of game for me to pass.

Then I was always afraid of full E2L5 and E2L9 levels, as they were really hard, and I was very much scared of the E2 final boss.

 

Cute but honest - I agree that many places in Duke were pretty creepy.

The atmosphere could violently change from guns blazing to "uh..oh... what's that?!?".

[PsychoGoatee]

13 hours ago, Jaxxoon R said:

Realistically speaking, people tend to run deeper than their surface qualities. I've seen all too many "funny guys" up and kill themselves one day. Not saying he's depressed, but I'd expect a guy as odd as Duke Nukem to have something he'd rather ignore.

 

I can get and respect the fun of subverting something, but in this case it's kind of a different sort of fan fiction. It'd be like saying Ash from Evil Dead will stop being a snarky self-assured blowhard at some point, realistic or not, it's not what's intended or written for the character in particular. Or rather, that he's tormented underneath. Which I don't think fits these characters myself. Just saying, the character is not intended to be tortured or suffering from ailments of any sort. Other than usual vices played for some comedy and antihero flavor.

Saying Duke has PTSD would be like saying Roger Rabbit would have PTSD. Granted, somebody could write that story, and it may be a hoot. Some of my favorite characters and people have PTSD or depression, sure, I don't think there's reason to think this particular character would though. But if that interpretation works for you, why not.

 

And on World Tour, it's terrific, the new episode is very very excellent. And it includes the Duke3D.grp so you can use that version with eDuke32 as well. Though kind of like the BFG edition Doom wads (both are handled by Nerve software), they changed the red cross on health packs to a pill symbol. Other than that the .grp is mostly the same as I recall. Also they added some fancy light placements and whatnot for the new engine which is cool. Actually as I recall, the .grp is the same I think the changed medkits are in external art tiles you can delete.

Edited November 19, 2017 by PsychoGoatee

[Deleted_Account]

I suspect Duke Nukem is clinically depressed after Duke Nukem Forever. A fat and mishapen mass of redundant protoplasm sitting on a couch watching talk shows and drinking beer. Surrounded by cheetos bags and burger wrappers with Hurt by Johnny Cash playing on loop in the background.

[PsychoGoatee]

1 minute ago, Piper Maru said:

I suspect Duke Nukem is clinically depressed after Duke Nukem Forever. A fat and mishapen mass of redundant protoplasm sitting on a couch watching talk shows and drinking beer. Surrounded by cheetos bags and burger wrappers with Hurt by Johnny Cash playing on loop in the background.

Doomguy comes over on weekends to watch wrestling pay-per-views with him though, which is nice. When he's on his upswings, some days it's tough to get out of that sarcophagus. It is comfortable in there.

[Avoozl]

9 hours ago, Decay said:

Personally I thought the N64 version having no music playing at all lent a lot to the overall atmosphere. When I was a kid I thought the game was quite grim, I should revisit it someday.

You might be interested to know that there is currently a Duke Nukem 64 TC available: http://www.moddb.com/mods/dn64

Edited November 19, 2017 by Avoozl : removing lines of spaces that somehow were added

[NeedHealth]

9 hours ago, reflex17 said:

 

You can get Megaton Edition on GOG.com.

 

The latest steam version "Duke Nukem 3d 20th World Tour" has a new fifth episode designed by Allen Blum III and Richard "Levelord" Gray, the level designers from the original Duke3d, along with new music and Duke talk. I haven't played this one myself so I can't comment on what it's like.

 

DUKE3d.GRP is the file that is required to run the game with source ports like JonoF's original port or Eduke32.

Could you point me to a link, because I went to gog . com and I could not find it.

[PsychoGoatee]

5 minutes ago, NeedHealth said:

Could you point me to a link, because I went to gog . com and I could not find it.

At the moment World Tour is the only version for sale digitally, which is 19.99 USD when not on a sale. Though if you get a key somewhere reputable for Megaton you can still redeem that I believe. There were also DOS versions of Duke 3D sold on steam and gog that may have keys out there somewhere to buy. If you have a CD-drive, you could buy a used Duke Nukem 3D Atomic Edition CD for a few bucks as well, and then use the .grp in eDuke32.

[NeedHealth]

Thanks for your help, but I am starting to wonder if I am in the wrong country.

[kmc]

1 minute ago, NeedHealth said:

Thanks for your help, but I am starting to wonder if I am in the wrong country.

I don't think gog carries it anymore:

https://www.gog.com/news/weekly_staff_picks_farewell_for_now_duke

[Endless]

And of course, Forever teaches us great lessons of life flooding us with nihilistic philosophy and dark environments that make us drown in the incensing agony that is life through holes of loneliness and sadness. Yes.

[PsychoGoatee]

1 hour ago, NeedHealth said:

Thanks for your help, but I am starting to wonder if I am in the wrong country.

Wow, just saw on Duke4 that Duke 3D World Tour is on sale for 6.79 USD on humblebundle. That's a steam key, not sure if what country you're in effects whether you can use that, great great deal though.

 

https://www.humblebundle.com/store/duke-nukem-3d-20th-anniversary-world-tour

 

[NeedHealth]

20 minutes ago, PsychoGoatee said:

Wow, just saw on Duke4 that Duke 3D World Tour is on sale for 6.79 USD on humblebundle. That's a steam key, not sure if what country you're in effects whether you can use that, great great deal though.

 

https://www.humblebundle.com/store/duke-nukem-3d-20th-anniversary-world-tour

 

Actually that worked here in a banana republic. Pretty funny, considering half the posts in the " post your music" -thread is worthless to me due to region filtering.

[DooM_RO]

14 hours ago, Roofi said:

I don't  know Duke NUkem very well , but this track is very spooky and depressing. It sounds like a music from a Resident Evil game.

 

But this also one of my favourites.

 

 

One of my favorites as well. You would almost think it doesn't fit Duke3D. You would expect to hear it in a quiet and contemplative game.

[reflex17]

5 hours ago, NeedHealth said:

Could you point me to a link, because I went to gog . com and I could not find it.

 

Oh it seems it went out of sale there in 2015. Sorry about that, I didn't know. :-/ 

[Alfonzo]

Some interesting observations. The macho personality of Duke never struck me much when I first played 3D at a (very) young age, just as the lewd content went sailing right over my head. I was always too arrested by mood and fear for the heart to get racing at the thought of such alien ideas as "gameplay" or "weapon feel." The monsters were fearsome; the environments were oppressive...; in every way an experience shaped by the unique circumstances of childhood. Does that mean that I was experiencing some qualities where there were none — or none so intended — for this and other games at that age? Probably. In Duke 3D's case, I'm not actually sure that this widely recognized moodiness was at some point developed by the team to the effect that we see. Did Prince and Jackson align themselves with a proposal, the rest of which the level designers had already fulfilled, or did the picture only finally emerge with the inclusion of their work?

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter what was intended. That's more a point of interest in development. The identity is dictated by the end user, individually and ultimately, a phenomenon which is as much responsible for discovering unexpected meaning and tone as it is for completely smothering those mysteries with popularity-led sequels. Doomguy as a blood-crazed, limb-ripping monster who tortures to the beat of metal music 24/7, for example.

 

@Jimmy captures this (un)intended mood of Duke 3D brilliantly in his authentic-sounding OST for Duke It Out in D.C.. Give this Sluice Gate a listen:

 

 

Edited November 19, 2017 by Alfonzo : Whoops, wrong track!

[DooM_RO]

5 minutes ago, Alfonzo said:

Some interesting observations. The macho personality of Duke never struck me much when I first played 3D at a (very) young age, just as the lewd content went sailing right over my head. I was always too arrested by mood and fear for the heart to get racing at the thought of such alien ideas as "gameplay" or "weapon feel." The monsters were fearsome; the environments were oppressive...; in every way an experience shaped by the unique circumstances of childhood. Does that mean that I was experiencing some qualities where there were none — or none so intended — for this and other games at that age? Probably. In Duke 3D's case, I'm not actually sure that this widely recognized moodiness was at some point developed by the team to the effect that we see. Did Prince and Jackson align themselves with a proposal, the rest of which the level designers had already fulfilled, or did the picture only finally emerge with the inclusion of their work?

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter what was intended. That's more a point of interest in development. The identity is dictated by the end user, individually and ultimately, a phenomenon which is as much responsible for discovering unexpected meaning and tone as much as it is for completely smothering those mysteries with popularity-led sequels. Doomguy as a blood-crazed, limb-ripping monster who tortures to the beat of metal music 24/7, for example.

 

Jimmy captures this (un)intended mood of Duke 3D brilliantly in his authentic-sounding OST for Duke It Out in D.C.. Give this Sluice Gate a listen:

 

 

 

You really need to write an article about this! I think people who consider Duke 3D to be a comedy shooter are doing a huge disservice to the game. It's the case of people remembering something differently than it actually was, similarly to how some people think Doom was more violent or harder than it actually was. 

 

Also, that track from Jimmy is just spot on!

 

Anyway, you should also check my thread about Ion Maiden, a new game coming on the Build Engine. Exciting times we live in! 

 

[Hisymak]

One thing that is a little depressing me on Duke Nukem is the color palette. It is kinda too gray-ish and lacks some vibrant colors (especially green). The textures themselves and monster sprites do not add much either.

Doom, in comparison, feels different. The textures and monsters are more pleasant-looking and the color palette feels more saturated (red, green, blue).