Level design tropes you dislike

Are there any level design "tropes" you dislike seeing in maps?

By level design tropes I mean everything from simple monster closets to things like horseshoe level design that John Romero invented (?) and perfected.

I started disliking the "take a side route and end up near the beginning of the map" trope,not because it's bad or anything but because I do that in literally all my latest maps.The only reason I continue doing it in my map is because people tend to like it.

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Mentioned on @Killer5 's stream earlier, items on teleport pads which warp you somewhere. There is a chance to not grab it before teleporting, which makes it a giant pain in the ass if it's a powerup or weapon, and the teleporter is taking you to a fight.

 

Getting infinite-height blocked in a map with ledges which is meant to be played fast. Scythe 26 is a perfect example, where if you ignore the junk on the lowest floor and rush the key objectives, the enemies can prevent you from falling off the last key ledge - whether you have an invul or not.

 

Insta-pop anything. The fast or tubo floor option looks way better.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

People putting stuff in their maps, because they think it's popular, while they have no clue about what they're doing at all. I remember someone who put a "slaughter fight" into a map without knowing anything about slaughter, other than it involves more than a dozen things being active at once, for example. The end result was dull, to say the least. But the funny part was that the mapper in question didn't like slaughter at all, quite the contrary was the case. So, the worst trope for me personally would be trying to copy a supposed trope poorly despite not liking said supposed trope at all.

So what I am doing right now :D

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One thing I've though about doing to mix things up is to have a key trap of several in a map were the trap is the door ( the walls open.)

 

Speaking of key traps.

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This is going to be a giant to-do list for someone.

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Your list is almost as impressive as your formatting.

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15 minutes ago, SOSU said:

So what I am doing right now :D

I dunno. I guess adding a side route of some sort isn't something I'd compare to designing a slaughter fight without actually having any expertise in the field. That aside, I think people shouldn't put things in their maps which they don't like themselves.

 

8 minutes ago, SteelPH said:

This is going to be a giant to-do list for someone.

Yes.

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In deathmatch:

  • Spawns that don't instantly give you a decent weapon
  • Maps that are difficult to move around in due to cramped hallways or excessive decor
  • Mandatory lifts to access certain parts of the map. Standing still waiting for the lift to go up and hoping you don't get fragged is torture
  • Spawn cubbies. Campers love to just park their asses and wait for the spawns
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9 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

Spawns that don't instantly give you a decent weapon

should the weapon be on the spawn or near it?

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Half-Life / Doom 3 style setups where the initial "gameplay" amounts to a forced cutscene (example Cheogsh 2).

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Maps with badly placed monsters ,and no sense of difficulty ( Dimensions)

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The overuse of edgy woodmetal + orange sky -theme. I'd rather play a dull indoors map with GRAYTALL textures.

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Flicking a key switch only for another switch to be just behind that switch is something I gleefully second from Memfis's list. Way too many of these and they just serve to piss off runners.

 

  • difficulty scaled by types of hitscanners (lowest settings has zombiemen, HMP has shotgun guys, UV/NM have chaingunners.) WORLD.wad is an example of a wad that does this.
  • in the beginning of a wad, I'm itching for a good weapon like a chaingun and the only chaingunners I find are out of reach.
  • The afrit and whatever custom zombie-like enemy (Z-sec or bad Doomguy). Really overused in "good" mapsets.
  • Gameplay that likes to focus on lifts, especially the up-and-down ones that require lots of waiting. Please don't let me spend minutes waiting for something in a wad, please.
  • And of course, platforming in general, especially if you fail and have to spend minutes getting back to where you were.
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I never like instant floor monster ambushes. I get they're supposed to be like some alternative to monster teleport ambush, but i like it when there's a visual and audial cue when something's about to happen. Instant floor just feels like a cheap jumpscare.

Edited by Danzadan
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hazard strips

having progression be obvious and consistently signposted rather than constructing it out of insane moon logic like all the good Doom 2 maps did

high-action midi that sounds stupid when you're not doing anything

humongous rooms with barely any light contrast (you can put light 256 next to light 112 if you want to, it's not illegal and it looks fucking cool)

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3 hours ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

I think people shouldn't put things in their maps which they don't like themselves.

That's a bit strong, don't you think? I mean, you'd get folks never using former commandos, pain elementals, lost souls, or arch-viles. Obviously, you should not try to please everyone, but there is something objective about a good map(set), so sometimes it's probably best to put aside one's subjective feelings in order to be a more complete mapper. For cheap example, I prefer keycards to skulls, but some situations just lend themselves more nicely toward skull keys. All that said, I certainly hear what you're saying.

 

For me, I would say inescapable damaging floor. I know it's probably more realistic than a teleporter out, but curiosity (which, admittedly, killed the cat) causes me to jump in every time to see if it goes anywhere/if there is a secret.

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1 hour ago, rehelekretep said:

 

How would you use Barons of Hell effectively ?

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eh, I think I get it. AVs depend on the design of the areas they inhabit, and so they're either trivial to deal with by simply ducking behind cover, or they're used in a way that gets the most out of their abilities. Limited cover, other monsters to distract you and probably get in the way and wreck your shit.

 

Neither of these scenarios is fun to me. I really don't enjoy "effective" arch-vile usage, so my preference is for the former case, but at that point you may as well just use a different monster.

 

56 minutes ago, rehelekretep said:

if someone just doesnt appreciate them then i dont want them to spam them badly because they think 'thats what good mapsets do'

This is exactly what I did in my DMP2016 map and it's the absolute worst. Awful, awful piece of pseudoslaughter shit, and retrospectively I wish I'd just scrapped it the moment I ran out of ideas.

 

So I guess ultimately I'm making the same point. I've been wondering lately about what's in-store for the archvile in my current WIP. There's probably enough frames to make two custom monsters from it...

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Use of a visual cue or clue to indicate the presence of a secret, when the same visual cue is used elsewhere in the map or the WAD as simple decoration.

 

Either your player encounters the secret first, finds it thanks to the clue, and then goes ahead to paw at every repetition of the same piece of design in the hope that it also hides a secret, or the encounter the decoration first and thus blunder right past the later secret thinking it's just another similar piece of decoration.

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4 minutes ago, NeedHealth said:

How would you use Barons of Hell effectively ?

That is a 10000 year old egyptian mystery no one solved until now.

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1 hour ago, yakfak said:

hazard strips

Heh I just added some hazard strip textures and am covering a map in them.

 

As for the OP:

Areas that feature symmetrical architecture and then proceed to have symmetrical item placement (or worse, symmetrical monster placement)

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16 minutes ago, NeedHealth said:

How would you use Barons of Hell effectively ?

E1M8

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Specific things in Doom that annoy you, part 48265485436197641013407234069570510485

 

- Secrets areas including fights are ok, but give me the reward later, not before!

- Why is a nukage pool signed as Poison, and don't do damage? Same as, no signs, but ouch ouch ouch ouch.

- Multiple archviles snipers from multiple angles, heights and distances. I don't think there's anything entertaining in that.

- Filler spiderdemons/cyberdemons, as if, see one from a distance and in no less than 15 seconds hear their death.

- Half of what Memfis said, the other half are actually fun ideas thanks!

 

45 minutes ago, NeedHealth said:

How would you use Barons of Hell effectively ?

Denying space; forcing you to kill them fast before they can corral you; tight rooms with forced RL usage; paired with other enemies so you need some infighting to gain freedom; to remove a filler cyberdemon for you; as meat shields to protect you from bullets; in a room with barrels, where you have to think how to kill him, or them; coupled with an archvile, so you must prevent this one to resurrect the other ones; with friendly crushers.

 

That's all I can think of right now. 

Edited by galileo31dos01
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@NeedHealth   You add a few to a horde of hell knights to make it more colorful :)

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