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K3K

Dark Souls Remaster Coming in May

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Hopefully Dark Souls 1 on PC won't be an unbearable mess now

 

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I wish it would be Demon Souls instead since i haven't played it yet but still very tempting. Guess there goes my spare time once it's may.

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God DAMN! I still barely touched this series! TOO MANY FUCKING GAMES! I'M DROWNING IN DAMN GAMES!

 

0c7.gif

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Thank fuck, I've never played the games but I figured I'd have to bite the bullet and just deal with the crappy port, but this pretty much does away entirely with that. I hear 2 has problems also, but not as bad as the first.

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15 minutes ago, cyan0s1s said:

Thank fuck, I've never played the games but I figured I'd have to bite the bullet and just deal with the crappy port, but this pretty much does away entirely with that. I hear 2 has problems also, but not as bad as the first.

I have the Prepare to Die edition and yeah, it's miserable. Capped at 30fps or so and shitty controls. I couldn't play the game for more than 5 minutes and then uninstalled it and never returned afterwards. There are some mods to improve the experience on PC ( https://steamcommunity.com/app/211420/discussions/0/627456486910837036/ ), but you can't polish a turd. Hope the remaster will do it justice.

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I never found Dark Souls 1 to be a particularly good game. I'm hoping for a "modernization" -- not a complete port of DS1 maps to DS3 mechanics or whatever, but some quality of life improvements that were added over the course of the series would be nice. The little things, like the equipment view in DS3 which shows you very clearly X stats will scale with Y weapon.

 

I feel like the lack of these little things in addition to hardware/engine limitations played some part in why I disliked DS1 so much -- it was visually incredibly boring for most of the game. I don't think a remaster will fix the very poor world and encounter layouts, but I can at least pray.

 

Also

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Running gag since the first game

"beware but hole"

"poison gas but hole"

"woman ahead therefore try tongue"

"woman ahead? but trap"

(in Gwynevere's room) "amazing chest ahead"

 

The list goes on.

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Another Re-master???? wow!! They must be selling like hot cakes. I have played Dark Souls and its bloody difficult.

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Debate amongst the community seems to center around the idea that DS2 is the easiest of the trilogy, and I'm inclined to agree after having played all three. If a DS1 remaster interests you, I humbly suggest picking up Scholar of the First Sin (an improved version of 2) and giving that a playthrough as your appetizer for DS1R

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2 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

Debate amongst the community seems to center around the idea that DS2 is the easiest of the trilogy, and I'm inclined to agree after having played all three. If a DS1 remaster interests you, I humbly suggest picking up Scholar of the First Sin (an improved version of 2) and giving that a playthrough as your appetizer for DS1R

DS2 is definitely the easiest in the trilogy, but it doesnt mean its not a hard game. Its made by a different director and producer, which means it plays a bit differently. lots of smaller areas, and more bosses. People wanted more boss fights, which makes sense. But Dark souls 1 is by far the hardest, with dark souls 3 bringing the middle ground, but not by much.

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7 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

it was visually incredibly boring for most of the game. I don't think a remaster will fix the very poor world

Of all the criticisms of Dark Souls, this is the first time I've ever heard this one!

 

Dark Souls is famous for having one of the most memorable and well designed game worlds ever. The way the levels are interconnected but distinct and somehow all fit into a single giant cylinder is inspired.

 

I have a 6 foot version of this fan-print up in my living room, and I never get tired of looking at it. I would honestly rate Dark Souls as having the best level design of any game in history. This genuinely looks boring to you?

 

Lordran_large.0.png

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It's not about the aesthetics but rather how game elements are placed, take for example Blighttown, many will praise it for its many interconnected roads leading to different places, but it was obviously built to be walked in specific paths and directions, which makes traversing it in other ways an annoying task, you'll constantly be assaulted by ranged enemies as you climb ladders and such.

 

At least it aint Brume Tower.

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5 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

Running gag since the first game

"beware but hole"

"poison gas but hole"

"woman ahead therefore try tongue"

"woman ahead? but trap"

(in Gwynevere's room) "amazing chest ahead"

 

The list goes on.

Don't forget.

"amazing chest ahead therefore try using two hands"

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14 minutes ago, K3K said:

Don't forget.

"amazing chest ahead therefore try using two hands"

:v .

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1 hour ago, YukiHerz said:

It's not about the aesthetics but rather how game elements are placed, take for example Blighttown, many will praise it for its many interconnected roads leading to different places, but it was obviously built to be walked in specific paths and directions, which makes traversing it in other ways an annoying task, you'll constantly be assaulted by ranged enemies as you climb ladders and such.

 

At least it aint Brume Tower.

 

A smaller part of my complaint does have to do with the visuals, but you're correct in saying the main part of my complaint has to do with the way the world is laid out. I found that often times, key parts of an encounter were only designed to be approached from one direction, so inevitably when I had to return through an area, they wouldn't respawn because From was aware the encounter doesn't work from a different direction. This meant that these sections ended up being a boring aimless memory game where I try to remember which path I didn't take yet while the ambient sounds of an empty level drove me to additional frustration. In other words, I'm suggesting that the "interconnected" world design in Dark Souls 1 in fact really hurts the game.

 

You wouldn't tolerate having to backtrack 20 times through the same confusing empty region of a Doom level, so I don't understand why Dark Souls 1 gets praise for this.

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9 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

 

A smaller part of my complaint does have to do with the visuals, but you're correct in saying the main part of my complaint has to do with the way the world is laid out. I found that often times, key parts of an encounter were only designed to be approached from one direction, so inevitably when I had to return through an area, they wouldn't respawn because From was aware the encounter doesn't work from a different direction. This meant that these sections ended up being a boring aimless memory game where I try to remember which path I didn't take yet while the ambient sounds of an empty level drove me to additional frustration. In other words, I'm suggesting that the "interconnected" world design in Dark Souls 1 in fact really hurts the game.

 

You wouldn't tolerate having to backtrack 20 times through the same confusing empty region of a Doom level, so I don't understand why Dark Souls 1 gets praise for this.

 

Hmm, I've noticed in most cases of this type of encounter you've described, the game allows you to teleport out of the area (Homeward Bone and/or Lordvessel) afterward. Although teleportation may be a crutch, this allows for players to skip any needless backtracking. Now there are a few sections where the interconnected world allows you to face encounters in the opposite direction, but these always have a strong enemy or a group of enemies in your way.

 

Also, there are only four major backtracking sections in the game (although only one is truly mandatory) as far as I know:

  1. Demon Ruins/Blighttown to Sen's Fortress (Mandatory)
  2. Firelink Shrine/Undead Parish to Lower Undead Burg (Skippable with the Master Key)
  3. Tomb of the Giants/Catacombs to Firelink Shrine (Skippable post-Lordvessel)
  4. The Abyss/New Londo Ruins to Firelink Shrine (Skippable post-Lordvessel or post-Four Kings)

And the mandatory backtrack is used to ramp up tension for some Lautrec x Firekeeper action (Although that only works best on your first playthrough).

Edited by SGS Man

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10 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

inevitably when I had to return through an area, they wouldn't respawn because From was aware the encounter doesn't work from a different direction.

Very unusual observation. Aside from the fact there are very few places you have to backtrack, I'm pretty sure that's also not how the game works. Enemies respawn when you use a Bonfire (dying, resting at one, or teleporting to one). It doesn't take into account any kind of approach direction. 

 

There's a lot of reasons to criticize Dark Souls, but I admit this is the first time I've heard this complaint. Most people complain the enemies respawn, not that the levels were too empty!  It kind of sounds like you'd clear a level, but then instead of progressing you'd backtrack for whatever reason and get annoyed the level was empty. I can honestly think of no reason why you'd need to backtrack through a level 20 times once you'd killed everything.

 

 

Edited by Bauul

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Dark Souls 1 has been the only game in the series I've played and I really can't wait to not be able to play this game because of maxing out my GPU

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3 hours ago, Bauul said:

Very unusual observation. Aside from the fact there are very few places you have to backtrack, I'm pretty sure that's also not how the game works. Enemies respawn when you use a Bonfire (dying, resting at one, or teleporting to one). It doesn't take into account any kind of approach direction.

 

There are many groups of enemies that do not respawn because the area was designed to offer an interesting encounter from one direction, and the encounter would result in unavoidable frustration or simply wouldn't be fun when faced from a different direction. For example, the toxic snipers in Blighttown would be close to unavoidable while climbing the long ladder on your way back up through the area in the opposite direction than intended, and to my knowledge this is required backtracking. Blighttown is the stand-out offender because that area seems more concerned with leading back to the Depths, on to Quelaag's Domain => the Demon Ruins => Lost Izalith, the Great Hollow => Ash Lake and the Valley of Drakes => Darkwood than it is with its own design design issues. Whoever designed the encounters for the area had to take into account that enemies in the area can be faced from a number of different directions, so compromises had to be made, and I think it shows.

 

4 hours ago, SGS Man said:

Hmm, I've noticed in most cases of this type of encounter you've described, the game allows you to teleport out of the area (Homeward Bone and/or Lordvessel) afterward. Although teleportation may be a crutch, this allows for players to skip any needless backtracking. Now there are a few sections where the interconnected world allows you to face encounters in the opposite direction, but these always have a strong enemy or a group of enemies in your way.

 

Also, there are only four major backtracking sections in the game (although only one is truly mandatory) as far as I know:

  1. Demon Ruins/Blighttown to Sen's Fortress (Mandatory)
  2. Firelink Shrine/Undead Parish to Lower Undead Burg (Skippable with the Master Key)
  3. Tomb of the Giants/Catacombs to Firelink Shrine (Skippable post-Lordvessel)
  4. The Abyss/New Londo Ruins to Firelink Shrine (Skippable post-Lordvessel or post-Four Kings)

And the mandatory backtrack is used to ramp up tension for some Lautrec x Firekeeper action (Although that only works best on your first playthrough).

 

I don't think it's fair to argue that if you chose the 'correct' starting gift, you can skip out on some parts of the game being annoying; a new player is not going to be aware that taking the Master Key will allow you to enter Blighttown from the Depths instead of through Darkwood for example, and the Lordvessel is not obtainable until roughly 1/2 to 2/3 of the way through the game (depending on how good or lucky you are). I distinctly remember being required to backtrack through Blighttown three times in particular (back through either the Depths or the Valley of Drakes to get to the Great Hollow and Ash Lake, again to get to the Demon Ruins and Lost Izalith, and one last time to get to Sen's Fortress). In fact, I would argue the Lordvessel exists because From conceded halfway through developing the game that backtracking through it was not fun.

 

To my knowledge, the only other way to get the Master Key is by buying it off of an NPC in the Depths (?), an area which you are almost definitely going to backtrack through to get back from Blighttown to Sen's Fortress.

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They should totally keep the sub 30FPS in Blightown.

 

It's part of the experience!

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1 hour ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

There are many groups of enemies that do not respawn because the area was designed to offer an interesting encounter from one direction, and the encounter would result in unavoidable frustration or simply wouldn't be fun when faced from a different direction. For example, the toxic snipers in Blighttown would be close to unavoidable while climbing the long ladder on your way back up through the area in the opposite direction than intended, and to my knowledge this is required backtracking. Blighttown is the stand-out offender because that area seems more concerned with leading back to the Depths, on to Quelaag's Domain => the Demon Ruins => Lost Izalith, the Great Hollow => Ash Lake and the Valley of Drakes => Darkwood than it is with its own design design issues. Whoever designed the encounters for the area had to take into account that enemies in the area can be faced from a number of different directions, so compromises had to be made, and I think it shows.

Assuming New Player / No Master Key progression, Blighttown can only be entered through the Depths. The Toxic Snipers are located on the second path which both serves as a shortcut to Blighttown for experienced players with the Master Key and as the most efficient route to Firelink Shrine for all players. Further this section is required backtracking only if you have the Master Key and use the shortcut, otherwise it's part of Normal Progression (Similar to the elevators from Undead Parish to Firelink Shrine). The Toxic Snipers are consistently avoidable provided you keep moving. I agree that their placement is annoying for newer players and the Toxic debuff is way too powerful though, which is probably why From made them permanently killable.

 

1 hour ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

I don't think it's fair to argue that if you chose the 'correct' starting gift, you can skip out on some parts of the game being annoying; a new player is not going to be aware that taking the Master Key will allow you to enter Blighttown from the Depths instead of through Darkwood for example, and the Lordvessel is not obtainable until roughly 1/2 to 2/3 of the way through the game (depending on how good or lucky you are). I distinctly remember being required to backtrack through Blighttown three times in particular (back through either the Depths or the Valley of Drakes to get to the Great Hollow and Ash Lake, again to get to the Demon Ruins and Lost Izalith, and one last time to get to Sen's Fortress). In fact, I would argue the Lordvessel exists because From conceded halfway through developing the game that backtracking through it was not fun.

 

To my knowledge, the only other way to get the Master Key is by buying it off of an NPC in the Depths (?), an area which you are almost definitely going to backtrack through to get back from Blighttown to Sen's Fortress.

 

I agree with the 'starting gift' statement but in the case of a new player only the first two backtracks are present since The Catacombs and New Londo Ruins have enemies that are designed to kill an inexperienced and weak player outright. Another potential major backtrack that I forgot to mention is Ash Lake / The Great Hollow to Blighttown, but for a new player, finding and returning from these areas (before the Lordvessel) does seem unlikely without a guide. From your descriptions of your backtracks it appears to me that you had the misfortune of not locating the secret bonfire next to Quelaag's Sister in an early playthrough, which is the only warpable bonfire in the entire area. I do believe that Blighttown should have had a better warpable bonfire.

 

Regarding the Lordvessel, the game actively pushes you to get to Anor Londo so you can start warping. The different paths allow for experienced players to have more options, but with that does come some backtracking. Also, the ideas behind warping existed back in Demon's Souls (and potentially King's Field). In fact, From probably established mid-game warping abilities as a goal early on, which explains the difference in level design quality before and after Anor Londo. Dark Souls II's and III's world design, while good, is nowhere near the quality of Dark Souls' because of early warping.

 

And yeah, the Toxic Sniper route is the fastest way out...

 

 

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4 hours ago, DILDOMASTER666 said:

For example, the toxic snipers in Blighttown would be close to unavoidable while climbing the long ladder on your way back up through the area in the opposite direction than intended, and to my knowledge this is required backtracking.

I'm pretty sure you don't have to backtrack through Blightown. Once you've killed Quelaag, you take the waterwheel exit that pops you out into the Valley of the Drakes and then the Firelink Shrine (the route you can do backwards if you have the Master Key). If you want to return to places like Ash Lake, you come back that way too.

 

You backtracked the entire way through Blightown, the Depths and the Lower Burg? Yeah, fair enough, that would have been a bit of a dull slog! But that's not the route you're meant to take. I'm actually more impressed with the game that it's even possible.

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