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UglyStru

Which WADs would you have people play through to get them into Doom?

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I'm not actually looking to get anybody into the game, but I just want to hear your opinions of some must-play WADs that anyone who likes FPS games should play before they die. 

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hmm if I think they're a seasoned arcade gamer maybe I'd say Rush or Vanguard

 

if they're into weirdness and sheer aesthetics, ALT and Bloody Steel

 

and then shove them towards Sunder so a new speedrunner will be born

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Depends on what they're looking for and their ability with other FPS.  

  

For easier going stuff: Violence, Counter-Attack, Tangerine Nightmare, Community Chest 4.  

  

Things maybe a bit harder but still fun: Speed of Doom/Resurgence, Miasma, Disjunction, Unholy Realms.  

  

Throwing them straight into the fire:  Slaughterfest 2012, Sunder, Toilet of the Gods, Cryogenics, Disciples of Darkness.

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Assuming that they play through Doom 1 and 2 (or at least one of them) first, I would probably reccomend Scythe, Violence, Tribute, and maybe Vanguard.

Those are probably the best starting wads, that I know of, since they aren't that hard, and a begginer could get through them with relative ease.

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Not even sure i would recommend any, i'd just be like: "Haven't played DOOM in forever? Let's co-op a bit on Zandronum, if you like all those badass maps we'll play i'll set you up with a list of must-play".

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Assuming we did the tutorial part already(Ultimate Doom and Doom 2), I would probably show them the official expansions, so Final Doom and the Master Levels.

 

But if we speak PWADs only, I would probably go for something classic like Alien Vendetta. 

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I would recommend that they start with some early classics like Scythe, Alien Vendetta, etc. That way those don't feel too lame after playing some newer ones like Speed of Doom.

 

I also try to recommend "mixed bag" WADs to noobs, that have a variety of gameplay styles represented. That way they can decide what they like and seek out WADs tailored to their preferences.

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Start with classic megawads all the way to the present wads for a good understanding of some Doom evolution throughout the years...

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Don't start with "classics", because most of those are plain and simple outdated in some way shape or form.

 

Give them the good stuff, give them the ribbiks maps, give them Miasma, give them Valiant and Ancient Aliens, let them see SunLust, and - for crying out loud - tell them to drop the difficulty if they need to. Check the most recent cacoward winning stuff. Stay away from the museum of sentimental values.

 

Keep them away from Scythe and Scythe II, those aren't up to "modern" standards, also keep them away from hell revealed and hell revealed II, don't give them Sunder either, because regardless of how legendary and influential these wads have been, someone who wants to get into a game does not care about history classes. History classes is what you can slap them with when they ask for it.

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I think I'd go with Stardate20x7 and BTSX, maybe with Sunlust thrown in?

 

It really depends on their tastes in gameplay and visuals. You don't want to drop a 32 map wad of any style on them before you know a bit about what they're into imo. Maybe the best way would be to start them with some very short but stylistically refined wads, like swtw, The Given, Skepland, Bauhaus, Frozen Time... possibly even Lilith?

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  • Scythe
  • Sunder
  • BTSX
  • Going Down
  • No Rest For The Living
  • Lunatic
  • Bauhaus
  • Pirate Doom
  • Brutal Doom
  • Alien Vendetta

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Ultimate Doom, Ultimate Doom, Ultimate doom and then the other Iwads. I feel that the brilliance of the original game(s) and their map design would be spoiled by jumping out of loop. Simple things like E1M3 soulsphere on the pedestal, or the cyberdemon fight would lose their magic if a person would have played trough grueling slaughtermaps and their generous givings of megaspheres and plasma packs. After that I would leave them for their own, since in the end, finding something yourself will motivate you to play trough it more than being seemingly touted stuff that you must "absolutely" play. Then again, it could just be that I haven't really played trough pwad megawads.

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3 minutes ago, 94's the best style said:

Ultimate Doom, Ultimate Doom, Ultimate doom and then the other Iwads. I feel that the brilliance of the original game(s) and their map design would be spoiled by jumping out of loop.

 

People, get a bit realistic. Showing this to people who never knew Doom from the 90's will just walk away and never come back. The same will happen with early megawads.

 

Depending on what someone knows about computer games the best way to start is to show them the really creative stuff. Maps like ZDCMP2 is what may convince a modern gamer to invest more time, i.e. show them something where such an old engine has some clear advantage over newer games - like making an insanely huge level where you can spend more than two hours easily.

 

Once you got them interested go lower, first by giving them some of the more ambitious modern megawads like Valiant or BTSX. Once they got hooked on the gameplay, then is the time to show them the classics.

 

But the step from "modern game" to "mid 90's Doom level" will normally be too large to stomach.

 

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Just now, Jerry.C said:

 

People, get a bit realistic. Showing this to people who never knew Doom from the 90's will just walk away and never come back. The same will happen with early megawads.

 

Depending on what someone knows about computer games the best way to start is to show them the really creative stuff. Maps like ZDCMP2 is what may convince a modern gamer to invest more time, i.e. show them something where such an old engine has some clear advantage over newer games - like making an insanely huge level where you can spend more than two hours easily.

 

Once you got them interested go lower, first by giving them some of the more ambitious modern megawads like Valiant or BTSX. Once they got hooked on the gameplay, then is the time to show them the classics.

 

But the step from "modern game" to "mid 90's Doom level" will normally be too large to stomach.

 

You have awfully little faith in Doom being a timeless game then. There's always a crowd of people who can only play the lastest things, why should a fanbase of over 20 years old game carter to them? Can't they be happy with the games the like to play?

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I have faith in Doom being a timeless game, but I do not have faith in most people's attention span.

You have to ease them into this totally different style of game. Throw them right in without any preparation and most will just thankfully decline.

 

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BTSX E1 then maybe E2 because it's stylish and has mixed Techno and Caverns atmosphere and the music is great.

Maybe Sunder because of the huge maps and crazy architecture, but the difficulty will probably throw 'em off, so might refrain from showing Sunder at first.

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I'd recommend Alien Vendetta as it has the perfect blend of classic gameplay and still holds up great to this day.

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Fraggle is making some good points with this creative stuff but it is also obvious that many here seem to think that showing them the WADs they like themselves is enough to hook non-Doomers.

 

I repeat what I said: This isn't going to work. Visually Doom and many of the classics are just too primitive. There's a reason why so many modern games put visuals over gameplay. People tend to react far more strongly to superficial properties than to inner strengths. You got to get them over this bulge before hooking them on the gameplay. I've seen this dozens of times. Show people E1M1 and they lose interest after a few minutes. Show them a late 90's level and you may hook them a bit longer but normally not long enough to convert them.

 

On one point I disagree with Fraggle, though: Iit's not a good thing to start with mods that do not resemble the original game. This may get their interest but not about the things you actually want to make them experience which is the classic gameplay.

 

This is why my prime choice is ZDCMP2. The gameplay of this map is still 95% Doom, but with major enhancements from the advanced engine. Show them this level and they take notice of the architecture and all the intricate detail. This may get them hooked long enough to realize that despite the low-fi resources there's actually a good game lying underneath and invest more time.

 

 

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I'm interpreting the title of the thread and the content of the opening post as two separate questions.

 

On one hand, there were some extremely compelling megawad experiences I had that I'd wish other people could experience the same way, but its not like watching a good movie. You have to act out the scenes, and if you can't control the protagonist a certain way, you'll be denied the captivating experiences we've had playing these wads.

 

But when it comes to getting people into Doom, I really think the really difficult modern wads we have today are best reserved for spectators, to watch speed demos and twitch streamers scream about how hard it is. People who are not very familiar with Doom will almost certainly find Sunlust or Stardate or Ancient Aliens painfully unfair without first playing through the IWADs.

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I'd start with BTSX E1, which I'll admit is my personal all-time fave megawad. It looks fantastic, has incredible music, and is not overly difficult.

 

After that, I'm not sure. Maybe the iwads, maybe some of the better CPs, probably anything by skillsaw. But I'm not so much a megawad player myself, so I'd likely suggest something like swtw, but on HNTR. We can't always be focused on the UV experience. Let people build up to the mass-murder maps. ;) 

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The obvious answer is to start with the IWADs, assuming that people haven't played them. Build it up from there, play a classic wad from 1997, then play a harder one from 2002, then go for something like a TC just to let them know that this works with the Doom engine.

 

You HAVE to ease them in. Don't make a mistake I did a while back.

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My 2 cents:

 

After I returned to Doom and finished the IWADs I proceeded to classics like Memento Mori and others which are generally held in high regard. Yes, they will feel dated in some aspects, no doubt about this, but the gameplay, the most important element, is solid so they should keep them excited or at least interested to go further. After that, I'd suggest some of the newer, modern wads, at first similar to what they previously checked out and gradually shift towards something that is more and more unique and represents different styles. I'd also absolutely avoid challenging wads as they will almost certainly not be enjoyable for newcomers, they first need to master the core aspects and basics of the gameplay, and only then try the more hardcore stuff.

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If someone was completely new to doom, I'd tell them to play Doom 2 and then TNT. I'd also tell them to play brutal doom because in spite of all its flaws, I think it's a good way to get a guy into Doom.

 

If they like Doom 2 and TNT, I'd tell them to play Empyrion or some 4-5 star rated single map wads from idgames.

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I'd say Brutal Doom, a friend of mine saw me play it one day and he liked the smooth animations and gore and all the fancy effects it offers, he didn't think it was a Doom mod until I told him.

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