Which WADs would you have people play through to get them into Doom?

[Killer5]

Crash course in different gameplay types. I don't know what kind of players the people will be which I am recommending wads to.. but I would want to make sure I find something that generally would appeal to many different types of players. I thought original Doom was pretty boring and would hardly play it at all outside of occasionally playing Brutal Doom through Episode 1 because I was given Momento Mori as a first pwad to play from a friend before he was like.. hmmm you might like something like Sunder. Voila it clicked and I started practicing and enjoying myself.

 

I'd be like.. hey Doom has some good straightforward gameplay:

BTSX: E1 map04

Scythe 2 episodes 1 and 3

 

Hey you want something that is larger and has more than one pace in the map but not too hard by most wad's standards?

Counter Attack

Altitude

 

Hey you want something that is really fun without being too hard?

Rush

 

Hey you want something that will bash your brains in?

Sunder

Slaughterfest 2012

Sunlust

 

Hey you want to see something completely from left field?

The Given

 

 

I don't think difficulty is good to go off of. It is too hard to tell how someone will react when seeing something for the first time. Give them a bunch of content and a few good maps from each one to play and let the person make up their own mind.

[mrthejoshmon]

I think "The Rebirth" and "Icarus: Alien Vangaurd" are simple, great and newbie friendly enough to be solid recommendations.

[seed]

10 minutes ago, mrthejoshmon said:

I think "The Rebirth" and "Icarus: Alien Vangaurd" are simple, great and newbie friendly enough to be solid recommendations.

Agreed.

 

I initially wanted to recommend Icarus as well in my original post but did this indirectly anyway. Yet, one possibly major problem with it is the limited amount of textures and colors used, especially in the first levels. I expect this to be an issue for a newcomer thinking that it's a boring and uninteresting wad due to the levels feeling too samey, despite the overall solid gameplay.

Edited February 5, 2018 by Agent6

[Novaseer]

8 hours ago, rehelekretep said:

oh wow look another thread has turned into a slaughter genre discussion; how novel!

 

im inclined to say, let them try out Doom 1 in GZDoom so it looks nicer (with freelook) so they feel more 'comfy' and arent put off by the 'retro' nature. my thinking is if theyre a retro gamer then they would have already tried Doom at this point!

You'd be surprised - I went to a retro gaming convention recently.

 

Only one person recognised my UAC T-shirt.

[StoneMason]

After the iwads, I'd say the Memento Moris for a taste of 90's mapping, the Scythes for 00's, and BTSX for 10's. I'd also recommend them playing Batman Doom, Urban Brawl, and Adventures of Square.

 

[bioshockfan90]

So I went ahead and tried some suggestions from this thread with a buddy of mine who beat the IWADs and wanted to keep going. So far, so good! Violence was enjoyed a lot, so next it's Vanguard.

[skillsaw]

On 2/5/2018 at 7:47 AM, Soundblock said:

This is an interesting question, as it shines a light to an "unwelcoming" paradox of progression with Doom maps. Levels have become increasingly mesmerising visually, which is a major selling point to hook newcomers, but gameplay of the newer streamlined looking wads seem almost always to contain progressive gameplay

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I wouldn't expect newer players to fall into the trap that so many members of this forum do - that is, the idea that the only acceptable skill level to play is Ultra-Violence. Difficulty settings exist, and newer players should be expected to play on lower settings, so that modern maps can accommodate a broader range of players. Ancient Aliens is somewhat accessible on skill 1 or 2, as are many other difficult wads, such as Sunlust, Going Down, SD20x7, etc.

 

That being said, for newcomers, I'd recommend a combination of things... I'd want potential mappers to see the broad range of things that are possible to do in modern source ports, so stuff like Vapordemo and ZDCMP 2 would be right at the top of the list, as well as things that really deliver on the promise of the base game's gameplay. I think Scythe X and UAC Ultra would be good, accessible examples of the latter.

[savagegrant]

DOOM1.WAD - The shareware episode of Doom is how most people got into Doom and it still stands the test of time. ;)

[galileo31dos01]

The two main iwads first, for obvious reasons. Depending on their will, I'll show them a source port according to their preferences, a friend of mine once rejected my suggestion because she likes modern graphics, maybe GZDoom with mods would be an ideal start for newcomers. If they liked them, we'll see later, always thinking about what they want, not what I'd want them to try, although yeah I'll add my own personal suggestions. 

[Soundblock]

12 hours ago, skillsaw said:

I wouldn't expect newer players to fall into the trap that so many members of this forum do - that is, the idea that the only acceptable skill level to play is Ultra-Violence. Difficulty settings exist, and newer players should be expected to play on lower settings, so that modern maps can accommodate a broader range of players. Ancient Aliens is somewhat accessible on skill 1 or 2, as are many other difficult wads

Ah, the "Ultra Violence" apothegm. The definition of which I fear we still struggle with, after all these years. This is exactly why I, when setting out to one-up the original iwads' difficulty level with my now archaic Cabal wads, shifted the labels of the difficulty settings down one notch, naming skill 4 "Total Carnage", so players of the original iwads would have an idea of water temperature before dipping their toe. This can certainly be a deciding factor in whether a potential player derives enjoyment from your creation. Post release I was exclusively and concurrently met with the feedback akin to "the author claims there's a new difficulty setting but all he did was change the graphics", even though I'm pretty sure Cabal's skill 3 is pretty even with Doom/Doom II's skill 4. Oh well.

 

Thanks for the cues on them wads! I'll be sure to lower the settings of my ego going in next time.

[40oz]

13 hours ago, skillsaw said:

I wouldn't expect newer players to fall into the trap that so many members of this forum do - that is, the idea that the only acceptable skill level to play is Ultra-Violence. Difficulty settings exist, and newer players should be expected to play on lower settings, so that modern maps can accommodate a broader range of players.

Well said. Do you think it's becoming more and more difficult to get direct feedback in terms of mapping for lowered skill settings? Skill settings are, after all, a feature that is dependent on how the mapper executes it. 

 

I'm too much of a bad dude to play on easier skill settings, so I can't say for sure that I know exactly what new players need to be introduced into the world of Doom. I have a pretty good idea of it, but I think everyone has differing interpretations of what is easier than the skill level they designed their map for. I don't think we really have any idea of how many people tried playing a custom Doom wad, died in the first room, said NOPE and stopped playing Doom forever after that.

 

[valkiriforce]

Lately I've been playing a lot of wads on lower difficulties - I played Nova 1 & 2 on Hey Not Too Rough, because lately I don't always know what to expect when it comes to enemy encounters (especially when it comes to projects like Nova where people are new to the mapping scene). I haven't had the same commitment to Doom as I used to, as I want to be able to play multiple maps in a row instead of getting stuck on one or two maps for a long time. For me it's been interesting to see lately how people have been handling the lower difficulties, and in my own mapping I've tried to balance it out so that the easy settings are a far more casual experience; things like mid-tiers blocking doors or hallways I would uncheck for the easy mode, so the map becomes easier to run and gun through. For Hurt Me Plenty I would sort of pepper a few of the UV placements to give a little of both worlds - between the casual run and gun and the challenging aspects, while UV remains as challenging as it needs to be. I mentioned recently in a review of Nova II that I did have some odd encounters on the easy setting, including empty monster closets that opened on MAP14 and lots of arch-viles at the end of MAP32, and I think even MAP15 had some tough chaingunners/revenants/arch-viles appear in the secret exit area. Unholy Realms was another wad that had some unusually unfair scenarios on the easy difficulties in some spots.

 

It's been interesting playing some wads this way, since it's given me insight to how much people have paid attention to enemy placement even on these lower settings. Some have managed to keep it casual while other mappers seem to have not as many brutal traps, while still leaving some of the higher-tier monsters in unusual higher density. I've been discouraged at times when checking some maps in the editors to find there was little difference - MAP24 of Scythe (and probably most maps in the third episode) is probably a more extreme example, as it hardly leaves any blinking difference between difficulties, so I was left frustrated when I did play it on easy and was still getting a massive butt-kicking. I really should have played it on Ultra-Violence, but I think a part of me expecting it to be easier on the lower settings is what sort of threw my guard off. Thankfully most maps I've played haven't been as extreme as this example.

 

Anyway, this has just been a fun little experience of mine, and all this coming back to balancing both for players inside and outside. For the most part I don't think it's been that off-putting, although I could be a little biased since I've been in the community for some time and have played plenty of difficult wads as well. Ultimately most people would assume the players have already played the IWADs so it's expected that most everything would be above that in terms of difficulty. I do sometimes wonder about it though, since part of the reward for me is watching people like my dad play through the first couple of maps from Reverie and being able to handle it.