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KVELLER

Do you actually run away from enemy encounters?

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Speedrunning aside, obviously.

 

I was wondering, because people seem to like to complain when a map lets you just run past enemies. I don't know about you, but I always stay and kill everything, unless it's against common sense to do so, I mean, that's the whole point of playing a combat focused game, right? This has lead me to some situations where I flip a switch after killing everyone, just to realize it opens a ridiculously long door which will actually be passable after two minutes.

 

This doesn't only affect Doom, either. Some people also say some other games are easy because you can run away from combat, but I have to ask: If you dislike the main mechanic of a game the enough to want to ignore it, then why are you playing it? There might be some games where this could be justified, but not in Doom.

 

I can understand wanting to do this if you're against a baron with the single shotgun or some other tedious situation, but more often than not this isn't the case.

 

Of course, this is just my opinion. I'd like to know what you guys think.

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Posted (edited)

Yes, and "don't run from enemy encounters" renders unplayable a huge variety of maps with lethal start areas that force the player to run away. Plus sometimes the map makes you run from enemy groups by making you run through them first.

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Even if you can run away from enemies in other games they usually chase you down. Or maybe not, guess that depends.

 

I don't run from fights in any game I play, especially in Doom. In fact I hunt 'em down like a maniac and inflict destruction upon my victims, although I still manage to miss a few every now and then, typically around secret areas that I miss. The only time I run away is when I'm dangerously low on ammo or health.

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Agent6 said:

Even if you can run away from enemies in other games they usually chase you down. Or maybe not, guess that depends.

 

I don't run from fights in any game I play, especially in Doom. In fact I hunt 'em down like a maniac and inflict destruction upon my victims, although I still manage to miss a few every now and then, typically around secret areas that I miss. The only time I run away is when I'm dangerously low on ammo or health.

In Descent, they'll let you go...and quietly take up optimal firing positions by the entrance in case you come back. 😉

 

This also means that instead of you kiting them down a chokepoint, they do it to you!

Edited by Woolie Wool

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If you're speedrunning and not attempting to make a max run, then yeah, why would you waste time killing enemies when you can just run past them?

 

Also some people might be complaining that you can run away from the monsters so as to reach a safe spot where you can pick them up at your leisure as they slowly make their way to you.

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As much as possible. 

 

The main mechanic of Doom is movement, not shooting.

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my main experience with plutonia 2 was repeatedly running away and looking for clumps of rockets in every map i liked

going toe to toe with the enemies is best left for teh experts

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Let's say you have to cross the road and there are no humans or cars anywhere in the vicinity. Are you still going to walk extremely carefully and keep turning your head all the time? Probably not. Only a certain amount of danger can motivate you to put some effort into crossing the road safely.

 

It's exactly the same with Doom. I don't see much point in fighting if I don't have to fight.

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I felt weird that the last map I made had some turreted revs and mancs that you didn't have to fight, but they did perform their goals as needed (I never died to them, but uncareful play in the area was highly punishing) so I ended up just always running past them and eventually got used to it. It's fine, they do their job and that's over when you're out of sight, not when they're dead.

 

When monsters are on ground level, I'm generally thorough about cleaning them up but when I feel its just too much and won't actually reduce danger, I'll flee.

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That depends, if I can easily run away from a group of say Hell Knights and never run into them again in the level, I'll just avoid them to save ammo.

 

If I leave a group of enemies in a room that I will eventually have to backtrack to, its typically in my best interest to kill them all so I don't get secretly grouped up on.

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I never skip killing monsters entirely; but if running past a group of enemies gives me a tactical advantage, I'll be sure to use it! Likewise, if an encounter is trivialized by backing out, I'll probably do it. Of course, this all depends on the difficulty of the map, but in general, I tend to play on the safe side.

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Unless I feel like I want to do a maxrun for a map I simply do not kill what I need not fear, unless of course the mapper forces boring shit down my throat by way of TID for example...

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My general approach on playing any new map is to explore as much open space as I can, and then to put myself into what I take to be the best position to settle in and engage from. This often involves going quite deep into a map just to get some decent supplies, and it often seems like I'm subverting the intended progression of the level. So yeah, when I start playing I'll happily run past (away from?) a lot of enounters. But I find this approach makes the combat more fun for me, since (ideally) a fair amount of chaos will have ensued by the time I get started, and I'm well equipped to deal with it. 

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Posted (edited)

@rdwpa Good points.

 

About this though:

 

2 hours ago, rdwpa said:

- Playing aggressively in search of better gear is fun.

- Multitasking is fun.

- It makes logical sense to leave stuff alive for later.

 

You're still coming back to kill them, and in fact, I also do these things every now and again. Maybe I didn't express myself correctly, but I was talking specifically about running away from enemies and engaging very little in combat, if at all.

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I often run from encounters, simply because if they're extremely punishing and are killing me again and again, and I don't have to kill them all, why would I bang my head against a wall then running away is so much easier?

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I guess that I love the sense of safety I get, by emptying rooms filled with demons.

 

If I can fight, I like to clear every room in the map, while taking my time and exploring each new area I find. Honestly, it feels good, so why shouldn't I do it?

Example: In 2002ADO, E2M6, in the teleporter room, I could have easily ran away, with all the cells the map gave me, and without facing 70-100 monsters, yet I continued firing, till I was sure the room was cleared.

 

I only run away from an encounter, if I am to save tons of ammo or I have little ammo left and I can't take out all the enemies. Even then tough, I'll think twice.

For an example, if I have to fight a boss or a cluster of enemies and there is a key door around, I will think about proceeding without killing everything, because I am safe afterwards.

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Instinctively, I run away from everything :P

 

Now being serious, more than running away I usually tend to look for the "safe" spot and then get back and confront whatever is out there. This applies to many circumstances where the surprise factor is relatively high, that is to say when X number of X types of monsters appear quickly in a space that exposes me to potential instant deaths. In incidental combat I will just be there and kill stuff, depending on what's there, but in traps (even in more "modern" ones) I can adapt myself to the situation if I'm initially aware of the kind of map I'm playing. Still, my first move would be to look at the monsters and then whatever I think at the moment: if I see archviles I'll try to kill them fast or look for cover asap, anything else that can be subject of infighting I'll leave it to that, while focusing on what needs to be killed to free space or lower the danger. It can happen that I simply run away (meaning, explore the trap while never shooting), because I'm a sucker for infighting, but it's more connected to try to give me some seconds to think what to do. If I die, it doesn't matter, unless I'm in a bad mood, eventually I'll figure it out. 

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Honestly, I run away more often than not. Enemies can get pretty lethal, especially if you don't have armor/enough ammo/weapons to dispatch them, which is another reason I dislike slaughtermaps.

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If the monster can't get to you and is not a hitscanner I'll usually leave them alone. Unless I have surplus ammo and I want 100% kills.

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My usual playstyle is the "Stalingrad Mode" where I slowly and carefully advance in order to NEVER TAKE A STEP BACK *whistles and flags*. That means I rarely rush in, I usually stick around walls and edges. I do like it when I have to break the Stalingrad tactic by backing up and taking a position to defend.

 

However, I rarely skip a fight entirely. If I do, I usually have a good reason to: For example, horde of pinkies cluttering the floor, and I am low on everything? If I can, I would bodysurf them and scream "HEEEEEELP!", and call it a day. If I cannot avoid it, I go back and scrounge the entire level before facing the pinkos again.

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In ZDoom I like to load up E2M8 and spawn dozens of Cyberdemons so that I can run away from them.

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Archviles and hitscanners (especially chaingunners) will totally shred you in certain maps if you don't run to take cover. Other than that I usually try to kill everything before proceeding, but alerting everything in the level and THEN going to town can be just as much if not more fun.

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Posted (edited)

If it's an obvious sudden ambush trap, yes I always run(unless it's only zombiemen) to a safer spot.

Mostly it depends on how the trap/situation is designed by the map maker though and if it's my first time playing through it I'm extra careful.

Edited by pulkmees

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Posted (edited)

Sometimes I will step back if I haven't BFG with plenty cells. It is important to remember ways of retreat and take strategically important point. Some map designers try to prevent that with no-return pathways or closing doors. Myself as the map author, foresee such traps.

Edited by riderr3

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In most combat situations I will fall back from a large group if possible and try to use cover and strategize to kill all the enemies, but I never just run past and leave them unless it's like a slaughtermap or a level with an infinite monster spawner.

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