Doom Movie Not This August

I don't care really, I don't have an ego for you to hurt, sorry. Like I said, I'm just amusing myself mostly.
Even if the movie does suck, even if it is your predictable, typical, hollywood crap, featuring mr. eyebrow twitch himself on the poster...

...I'm sure many of you will still like it. And that will not end my world. Just like EVERYONE seems to think that Armageddon and Independance Day were the best two movies EVER made.
I personally think that all people who feel this way are shallow and therefore must die by having there intestines removed from there anus while there heart still beats, but...


...well anyhow.

What was I saying? OH ya, it's just a movie, and this is just a thread. Granted I may have to kill some of you when all of this is over, but until then, try to relax, ok?

file this one under up, will you shut the fuck.

first you go on and on about how it's going to suck (with faulty logic mind you), then you call people "zealous of hollywood films" (way to fucking generalize), then you go back on yourself and say "oh well its just a movie." if it were just a movie, then why were you so adamant on insisting it sucked, when you haven't even seen it?

you sure you're 30? you sound like a 14-year-old, especially with that crap about "shallow people must die blahblahblah". honestly. i love how you lump anyone who steps up to defend the doom movie with people whose favourite movies were armageddon and independance day.

you know what? don't go back to college. it would destroy you. no, your place is BAGGING MY GROCERIES

and i want paper, please.

this discussion is over.

dethtoll said:

certainly the only film paul anderson ever made that didn't make him look like a hack

What about Mortal Kombat?

XDelusion said:

Anyhow go waste your $9.00 at the theaters

Damn. I don't know where you live, but where I live (south Texas) the most expensive price for movie tickets I've seen is about $6.50.

It's going to suck, but I'm going to watch it anyway. God I suck.

Dethtoll: Did you miss the part where I said I'm just amusing myself? Can you act anymore suburban? Is it the height of your worries that someone is complaining about a movie? I AM JUST HAVING A LAUGH, of cours I'm contradicting myself, you've fallen into my trap.
If I really wanted to argue, then I'd bring up the slave labor that Amerikka feeds upon for it goods, entertainment, and resources (yes I'm guilty too, but concious at least), I'd bring up the neglect of the poor and helpless within America's own boarders, I'd lash out about how Mr. Bush and corprate America is slowly (if they have not already) killing Democracy as we know it, etc. There are MANY MANY more important matters to focus one's mind on.
Just the mere fact that no one protested a blind war, until it began to effect there pocket books just shows who is truely "mature" and who is not.
Anyhow....

I'm sure I'll see it too, just not when it first comes out, I'll wait till it hits the dollar theatre.
Aside of the script, which according to some sources is subject to change, there are many other factors that make DOOM, DOOM.

First off, when ID created DOOM, they were influenced to do so by watching the movies Evil Dead 1/2, and Alien. Given that both movies gained FULL inspiration from the writings of H. P. Lovecraft, I'd have to say that the movie should be full of H. P. Lovecraft elements as well. Among these are the facts that:

A: EVERYBODY DIES!

B: If everybody does not die, then they go completely insane, and must live an exsistence of extreme madness and suffering.

C: The survivor also may transform back into his primal nature, which is a creature of chaos.

Somehow, I doubt The Rock (not to mention 99.9% of the other Hollywood actors) is capable of expressing believable fear, madness, sadness, etc.

The guy only has one expression, and one tone of voice.
He will no doubt portray a hard ass who comes in, and kicks a lot of butt, though in the process he may take a few hits himself, none the less, the hero will emerge victorious...

...though they may set the stage for a sequal so that the money machine can keep cashing in.

DOOM was ment to be a horror/thriller about madness and the feeling of helplessness, not about some brute fighting against the odds.

Hell, even DOOM (pre-Ultimate DOOM) had a bogus ending for the main character. :)

Of course you never know, The Rock may die in the movie, but if he does, he'll die a Hero, I bet you anything. He won't die alone, he won't die in vein, and he most certainly will not live on to only go insane.

Until your next childish slam, I'll be waiting to school you...


...oh futile suburbanite. ;)

Man, I really dont get why you guys get so upset over this stupid movie. It's an action flick designed to capitalize on a popular video game series. It's not going to be a masterpiece no matter what story it follows. It's going to have lots of explosions and gunfire with some cheap scare and suspense tactics. I'm neither defending nor condemning the movie (I cant since I haven seen it yet). Im just calling it as what it is going to be. An action flick.

Think about the movie Independance Day. It's not a good movie by any means. But I bet a lot of people here had fun watching it anyway. It was quick, cheap entertainment. You watch it for 2 hours and then go on about your day.

At best, we'll get some cheap thrills, have some fun, and get on with our lives. At worst it'll be mindnumbingly boring (I'm looking at you, Ring 2).

Oh yeah, as for the date change, well I guess that sucks... or something. Unless ticket prices rise before the movie is released (currently about $9-$10), then it doesnt really make a difference.

Edit: Oh yeah, if anything we can have fun digging for impse innuendo.

I've not seen Ring 2 yet. I wasn't fond of the first one AT ALL, as I had seen the Japanese version first. Granted the extra gore was a nice touch, but they butchered the story line.

From the sounds of part two, they are barrowing a lot of elements from the Japanese part 2, but taking it in a whole new direction.

If you like J-Horror, you should check out Dark Water. It is the BEST ghost story I have ever seen. Infact I would have to say it even surpassed The Changeling:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0783116926/qid=1113804622/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-6076992-3208052?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846

Of course America wants to capitalize on this one too, so they are going to remake it as well as The Eye. Though I have to admit I am intersted in the Americanized version of Dark Water, since Jennifer Connelly is taking the lead role. I dunno if any of you have watched anything from this beauty, but she's known for taking upon some strange roles, such as in Dark City, and Requieum For A Dream.

XDelusion said:
First off, when ID created DOOM, they were influenced to do so by watching the movies Evil Dead 1/2, and Alien. Given that both movies gained FULL inspiration from the writings of H. P. Lovecraft, I'd have to say that the movie should be full of H. P. Lovecraft elements as well.

Said movies where influenced by obvious lovecraftian elements, but certainly not directly. And then DOOM took aesthetic elements from Evil Dead II and Aliens (and not Alien) to create a first person perspective game that resembled hack n' slash styled play like in old-school D&D, and standard action enemy-filled video games that preceded it.

The subtle elements of fear and the unknown found in Lovecraft's works are explioted only marginally by the theme and story to set the grim mood, but they don't represent the game directly. It has humor and mindless mayhem instead, like in the two inspirational movies.

Perhaps DOOM 3 has a bit more to do with those elements of fear... but not much more. The FPS is not a good environment for fear. Alien and Event Horizon (which is sort of a post Hell Razor remake of the former, as far as movies go) have characters stranded in fragile and vulnerable situations where they become hopeless against a great evil, while FPS games have ammo and brutal weaponry and potent armoring strewn all over so that you can blast your way midlessly through the countless lesser threats.

The guy only has one expression, and one tone of voice.
He will no doubt portray a hard ass who comes in, and kicks a lot of butt, though in the process he may take a few hits himself, none the less, the hero will emerge victorious...

Sounds perfectly like the game's main character to me!

DOOM was ment to be a horror/thriller about madness and the feeling of helplessness, not about some brute fighting against the odds.

DOOM the game is basically the Aliens action flick crossed with Evil Dead II styled demonic possession.

Hell, even DOOM (pre-Ultimate DOOM) had a bogus ending for the main character. :)

Both of the inspirational movies have similar elements; one where the character is dragged around to demonic places, the other where marines die.

Until your next childish slam, I'll be waiting to school you...

...oh futile suburbanite. ;)

Well. Whist you concentrated on the suburbanite's heavily-armed ruthless frontal attack, I placed my envenomed dirk in your exposed back, my friend. Farewell and see you in burning Hell.

Ya... I am a little suburbancentric ain't I? :)

Well it was a fun little type out at any rate.

Dodge said:

What about Mortal Kombat?

heh. what ABOUT it?

XDelusion said:

Somehow, I doubt The Rock (not to mention 99.9% of the other Hollywood actors) is capable of expressing believable fear, madness, sadness, etc.

You really need to read up on this film some more. The majority of the actors are not Hollywood actors, they come from the British film & TV industry.

Of course you never know, The Rock may die in the movie, but if he does, he'll die a Hero, I bet you anything. He won't die alone, he won't die in vein, and he most certainly will not live on to only go insane.

I'll take that bet. What with the Rock already confirming his character will turn into a bad guy and all...

Karl Urban is the main character in this film, not the Rock.

myk said:

The FPS is not a good environment for fear.

I have two words for you, "System" and "Shock". Sure it's an RPG, but before that it's an FPS.

or are they using the cast from Wonder Showzen?

dethtoll said:

heh. what ABOUT it?

It wasn't totally cornball-ish compared to the rest of the movies he's directed.

kristus said:

I have two words for you, "System" and "Shock". Sure it's an RPG, but before that it's an FPS.

also, both alien versus predator games for PC, playing as a marine. what makes 'em special? you can hear them coming, you can barely see them in the dark, they make all kinds of noises and your motion tracker's going nuts... and they're all around you.

also, clive barker's undying.

also, they hunger mod for HL. by association, the ravenholm chapter in HL2. those zombie noises are flat-out disturbing.

The FPS is not only a great environment for fear, it's better than any other genre of game. The Resident Evil and Silent Hill series would be far more terrifying if they were played with a first person view.

Besides the games already mentioned, the Thief games (first person sneakers rather than shooters) can get extremely scary and tense at times. The main baddie in Thief 3 and her golems are downright creepy, and the music that's played while you're in her lair is some of the scariest I've ever heard.

Maybe FPG (generic for First Person Game) would fit the bill... and not that some of the games mentioned don't have some fear inspiring elements. Even DOOM itself has those, such as when you hear a Cyberdemon or an Arch-Vile (though other monsters count too) through the walls, but only as long as the circumstances are right. Fear generally comes from stifled hopes; in the traditional FPS that can happen if your resources are running low. But then, other than some effects, the games that are scariest use elements from other gernes to enhance the experience.

But shooting things is action oriented, which is repetitive, and doesn't get you far if you have to many fear giving elements, like bad visibility, puny weaponry, or excessive vulnerability.

The FPS relies on a relatively stable environment to provide a tactical combat challenge, whereas the RPG (more suited for fear) relies on new environments that leave the player guessing and unsure (potentially afraid.)

I've been playing RPGs since the late 80's, and the only one I ever found to be especially scary is System Shock 2... and as already mentioned, that's an FPS/RPG hybrid.

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines (which again is an FPS/RPG hybrid) had it's moments, but it's nowhere near as terrifying as f.ex. Doom 3.

And what does that show? The fact is, a first person perspective game using DOOM 3's fear inspiring elements in a scenario where the main point is exploration, escape, or some particular objective, as opposed to eliminating opponents with your trusty weapons, makes a spookier experience. Not to mention that in an action oriented game the "fear" is shock geared towards imminent destruction with the solid hope of prevailing through firepower, as opposed to some unknown inexplicable horror that's eyeing your soul.

Also, most RPGs tend to try adding a complexity that undermines immediacy. A game with less fabrication around the player's persona and more action will be more immersive than these. RPGs are often better at flatly telling a story than getting you to feel involved in the events.

This is not said to correlate with or compare to the games we've played, but to point out some elements in FPSs (and RPGs, since they were mentioned) that make them inadequate for a true dread inspiring environment, and in relation to XDelusion's statement tying DOOM more to Alien than to a straighforward action flick.

Let's hope this time Doomworld doesn't become a bottomless 404 again when I hit Submit Reply, as it did a couple hours ago... I'll close my eyes as I click to keep the fears at bay.

Well now we're on to a different issue entirely. RPGs are certainly one of the most immersive of genres (especially if the writing is good and the world believable), but being immersed and being scared are hardly the same thing.

FPS and survival horror are the home of fear inspiring games. RPGs are great at generating wonder, sympathy, puzzlement, worry, love, hate, etc... but I've not once played a non-FPS hybrid RPG that caused me to be scared in the slightest.

Of course I haven't played every RPG ever made, so perhaps I've hard the misfortune to miss these terrifying RPGs... so perhaps you'd care to provide a few examples?

I don't believe RPGs are that immersive; being immersed is being involved. Brooding fear is certainly "immersion," shocking fear (or momentary fright) is less so.

The part of RPGs that make them less immersive is the objective third person nature of the role, as opposed to the player, and the imaginary world as opposed to simply being in a strange place without an interpretational proxy. That's likely one of the main reasons I drifted away from RPGs; the paraphernalia related to the role becomes cumbersome rubbish.

I'd say they create a distracting illusiory world of entertainment, but that immersion is a much more direct and sensory thing.

Not that I don't kind of agree with the rest of your post about RPGs.

But again, these are elements, which are important to the gerne, not the result of a catalogue of existing games.

If you ask me, I haven't played many a fear inspiring game... perhaps FPSs can be somewhat so as you first play them, if the setting is correct, but the violent nature and savegames or restarts tend to diminish that a lot. That's why I mention above a game that's similar to an FPS but isn't geared towards defeating opponents, and doesn't have the excess descriptive adornments of most RPGs, that would make a great fear intensive scenario.

The fear factor in Doom 3 isn't generated by the sudden shocks, but by the atmosphere. The sound effects, the lighting, the general environment is what creates it. If the game had exactly the same monsters and they appeared in exactly the same fashion, but the setting was a gigantic castle made from chocolate and sweets, it wouldn't have been scary in the slightest ;).

BTW I actually mentioned a series of first person games that are neither based around killing things nor RPGs, in my first post on the subject :). The Thief series mainly involves stealing stuff, but exploration forms a large part of it as well (not so much in Thief 3 though), and a few missions (such as Thief 1's Down In the Bonehoard and The Lost City) are a lot more about exploration than stealing.

With regards to RPGs, remember that not all of them are played in 3rd person. Some of my favourite RPGs are viewed from a first person perspective, such as the Eye of the Beholder Series, the Ultima Underworld series, the System Shock series, the Elder Scrolls series, and Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines. Of those, only the System Shocks and Bloodlines have shooter elements grafted on to them.

Having said that, Baldur's Gate 2 remains my favourite RPG ;).

I don't care if the Doom Guy is fighting leprechauns in a castle made of sweets with a magic candy cane wand and a pink tu-tu, I'm still going to see it. :P

generally good movies come out in the end of the year. Maybe it's being moved for Oscar consideration. :p

The Rock won't be the main character? Hmmm, maybe he'll go Sargeant Kelly on us in the film

OMFG The Rock the fkn rock ffs, all this time for a Doom movie and it's gonna star the fkn rock. I just knew they would fuck this one up, typical hollywood bullshit, cast some dickhead Bgrade hollywood fuckwit in the movie. why cant someone just make a fucking based around good filmaking then faggot posterboys for every role.

GODAMMIT!!

:(

I saw The Rundown. The Rock does not rock.

Edit: It's Hollywood, what else do you expect?

Mainly British cast, mostly British/European crew, filmed in the Czech Republic. How is that a Hollywood film?

Check your facts next time, fellas.