Still, its not very 'Doomish'

If he was a big fluffy toy walking around with a nerf gun

Now there's a nice idea for some cheat code.

mmnpsrsoskl said:

How the Doomguy looks is as important as how the engine looks, how anything looks. I mean, he has to have a certain, "character", otehrwise he wouldn't "seem" like the Doomguy...you know what I mean? If he was a big fluffy toy walking around with a nerf gun, that just wouldn't seem right...obviously. In the end, it doesn't really matter, cause it's still DooM III but it would feel not like it.

If anyone can understand that, hooray! If not, beh.

Well, it's evident that I understand you. It's, like I said above, all about being compfortabel with your character, and I happen to like "Badass-combat-hardened-soldier" types - the old Doomguy is by far my favorite hero in any game I've tried, (there's something really cool about his looks imo) so it's pretty obvious that I'm a bit upset that he doesn't look like the old Doomguy.

dsm said:

Funny, I think of cramped spaces when I think about Doom - and that shit about the "transformation between light and dark was scary" is BS. The scare factor of Doom was chiefly cramped spaces, monster growling sounds and your occasional dark room - the new game seems to capture this nicely (ESPECIALLY because there's a lot of darkness. I like how the game is so dark generally - it gives a better impression of a base where everything has litterally gone to Hell.

And if you look more carefully at the video, you'll see a few rooms which are lighted up (I saw at least ONE room which was lighted up in the gameplay part of the video).

uh, THE FIRST ROOM OF THE GAME TAKES PLACE IN BROAD DAYLIGHT AND IS ABOUT THIRTY FEET ACROSS. there are VERY little places in the original doom, even in the later levels that are even HALF as cramped as the new video shows. My point was that the whole base goes to hell WAY too quckly, there doesnt seem to be enough midway

Xian said:

uh, THE FIRST ROOM OF THE GAME TAKES PLACE IN BROAD DAYLIGHT AND IS ABOUT THIRTY FEET ACROSS. there are VERY little places in the original doom, even in the later levels that are even HALF as cramped as the new video shows. My point was that the whole base goes to hell WAY too quckly, there doesnt seem to be enough midway

Yeah, but what about the darkened labyrinth in E1M2? That's cramped space and you come across more of it later in the game.
And might I add: You've only seen a fucking video recoreded demo of the game - not only does the camera angle screw up the dimension of the view making the rooms look smaller than they probably are, but the low quality of the video adds to the darkness.

I'm sure that the full game will have some more large rooms (those levels you saw in the demo might as well be changed completely in the final release) as well as outdoor areas - id has stated (a rather long time ago) that their new engine will support large outdoor areas (so I can't see why there wouldn't be any large rooms either) plus, the demo (the bit before the leaked version begins) is said to show a Martian landscape.

And another thing: The old Doom levels weren't really all that realistic, the new levels seem much more like an area inside a space station.

The old DOOM's Ep1 is something on its own. We won't see any of that in DOOM 3. My guess is DOOM 3 will make you think of Ep2 if anything from the original DOOM.

If your not satified with the Doom 3 you can always remake it to look like the old Doom and you can bet someone will, like give fat Zombies shotguns, and other zombies green hair,make chain gunners black not to mention change birdmans face to look more like Barron of Hell throw in those old Doom wall textures and remake the classic levels in more detail.

Most of what i've seen of Doom3 reminds me of the spaceship in Aliens: Resurrection.

Fredrik said:

The old DOOM's Ep1 is something on its own. We won't see any of that in DOOM 3. My guess is DOOM 3 will make you think of Ep2 if anything from the original DOOM.

Exactly. I love E2, especially the early maps.

Remember the original Doom wasn't about scaring the player. It was mainly about action, with some scary parts like the end of E1M5, or that wooden maze in one of the later E2 maps.

Lord FlatHead said:

Remember the original Doom wasn't about scaring the player. It was mainly about action, with some scary parts like the end of E1M5, or that wooden maze in one of the later E2 maps.

Funny, everyone seems to be going on about how the scare factor was the most important aspect of the old Doom, but I'd agree that the old Doom had actually more emphasis on action.

I've already fallen in love with the new Doom game, simply because the action seems so wonderfully intense (like in the old Doom), yet still it has a wonderful creepy atmosphere - let's hope the music is going to be "cool creepy" and not "shitty creepy".

The old Dooms didn't scare me. The constant action atmosphere seemed out of place. This new Doom though... it looks like its going to be the scariest game since System Shock 2.

I had this discussion at Q3W with a few of the guys, and we were talking about the feel of D3...one guy kept saying that lots and lots of monsters at once was scary, and I kept trying to enlighten him that it's just chaotic - fear is engendered by suspense, i.e. breaks in the action - play Aliens Versus Predator with the lights off at 3 a.m. to see what I mean :D.

scary factor alone is only not what make DOOM.intense action is also a factor.i`d like to see look-like-a-hopeless scenario in DOOM3 too. (eg. first fight with BoH or Cybie,DOOM2` Trick and Trap ,Gotcha!,Icon of Sin)

Well, if people start complaining about Doom 3 being too scary to be true to Doom, I wouldn't know whether to laugh or cry.

Ever since id announced that "they were working on a new Doom game", I have seen almost nothing but "this game needs to scare the crap out of you to be Doom".

When I look at the leaked video, I see a suspenseful, scary game with loads of action in it (it even seems like it has more action than RtCW) - pretty much in the old Doom's spirit and as such, I'm pretty damn satisfied with that.

And I don't give a good God damn about the new Doom having more cramped spaces than any of the other Dooms or the lighting being to dark and all that shit.

I'm satisfied with how DOOM III is looking. It's not dark, cramped or scarce on action, IMO. It's close to perfect :)

Shaviro said:

I'm satisfied with how DOOM III is looking. It's not dark, cramped or scarce on action, IMO. It's close to perfect :)

This is the second time I say this today: My thoughts exactly.

Little Faith said:

Most of what i've seen of Doom3 reminds me of the spaceship in Aliens: Resurrection.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Imagine an Aliens-game with this engine o_0

Disorder said:

That's exactly what I was thinking. Imagine an Aliens-game with this engine o_0

Well, the original Doom WAS inspired by the aliens movie afaik (I think it was even intended to BE an aliens game at first), so this is hardly surprising.

Yeah and look how all the monsters have gone Giger'ish.

The title should be: Doom 3 the coming of the cucumberheads.

Little Faith said:

The title should be: Doom 3 the coming of the cucumberheads.

You are "a little" too late for that, we've already had plenty of "New Doom title suggestions" threads.

Little Faith said:

Yeah and look how all the monsters have gone Giger'ish.

That's a good thing, though...:-)...Giger rocks my world.

I notice alot of people state the details and how they want things to be realistic "like the original". However, I think the reason that doom was so visceral and exciting and surreal is the fact that it was far from realistic. Look at any level and tell me that it looks like anything in the real world. I would venture a guess at no. Take E1M1 for example, it's supposed to be a base of some sort, or something to that effect, but it doesn't look anything like something that would be constructed for that purpose.

We are used to looking at doom levels from a vague, blurry point of view. A theme is never really defined in any level. Nowadays, ever modern game has levels and models that are supposed to be as realistic as possible but realism != gameplay or mood. That's what I loved about making maps for doom. It could be vague, but look great.

Ever notice how user made maps in the form of a house or a city or whatever, seemed artificial and crappy regardless of how well made they were?

I dunno, thats just what I think. Doom left the realism to the imagination rather than the game itself.

Tarkus said:

Ever notice how user made maps in the form of a house or a city or whatever, seemed artificial and crappy regardless of how well made they were?

You're talking about a game that doesn't support real 3d editing. While crazy-ass scenarios let you build weird detailed scenes filled with wow-factor, there's something about realistic scenarios (realistic as "this place serves some recognizable purpose") that really impresses me. I guess it's because I'm able to recognize scales and what's around me. Arbitrary techie brushes aren't as inmersive as one simple toilet.

Tarkus said:

I notice alot of people state the details and how they want things to be realistic "like the original". However, I think the reason that doom was so visceral and exciting and surreal is the fact that it was far from realistic. Look at any level and tell me that it looks like anything in the real world. I would venture a guess at no. Take E1M1 for example, it's supposed to be a base of some sort, or something to that effect, but it doesn't look anything like something that would be constructed for that purpose.

Well, Doom's levels looked realistic for the time - especially compared to Wolf3d's plain levels.
I remember my reaction to seeing Doom the first time being something like: "Holy cow! This really LOOKS like a space station - look at all those lifts, stairs, computerized machinery, etc.!"
Back then you didn't care much if a room had a purpose, the overall looks of the levels was what counted and most of E1's levels seemed like real places.

What I'm trying to convey is akin to standing a certain distance from a painting in order or enjoy it, or make it seem more real. It was the generic look and mood of the maps that made it seem real, not the details... our mind filled in the gaps.

Doom 3's engine will make sure that you can't have huge amounts of monsters on the screen at the same time, which effectively means that D3 won't be anything like Doom. A few weapons and monsters from the original isn't enough to give it the same feeling.

quest said:

Doom 3's engine will make sure that you can't have huge amounts of monsters on the screen at the same time, which effectively means that D3 won't be anything like Doom. A few weapons and monsters from the original isn't enough to give it the same feeling.

Doom 1 wasn't really about having huge amounts of monsters on-screen. Doom 1 was more about suspense and fear.

Tarkus has very good points there! That vagueness of the original Doom levels was exactly the thing I liked about them.

Yes, but he's named after an Emerson, Lake and Palmer CD - chances are he's reasonably intelligent to start with :-).

Prog rock rules.

:-)

Little Faith said:

Most of what i've seen of Doom3 reminds me of the spaceship in Aliens: Resurrection.

Maybe that's the idea.

John Carmack has described the look of Doom III as "something out of a set for Aliens". Remember the concept behind the original Doom was a cross between Aliens and Evil Dead 2.