That bridge trick...

Can anyone tell me how the hell you make a fake-3d bridge? (Couple of 'em in Eternal Doom and others). I can almost get it to work. I can get the invisible platform needed, and it drops instantly to the floor without a problem, but when the bridge raises again, a wierd 'ghost floor' appears. Not sure if I'm explaining it right. I'm using WadAuthor, but don't know if that makes any difference, as it can handle the 'instant sector drop' trick without any problem, and I know the bridge trick is just an extension of that. I've tried following the example here on Doomworld, too, but can't seem to get it right.
I know how to do invisible doors, invisible platforms and instant drop sectors, but this one I just can't figure out!

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Is your bridge a sector in itself (wrong), or just a load of linedefs? (right). If they are linedefs, are they referring to the correct sectors? (ie. the right dummy sectors)

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http://www.doomworld.com/tutorials/fx8.shtml

I haven't made one in a long time, but essentially you need to make the linedefs of the invisivle sectors have the same properties (floor/ceiling texture, light level) as the sector surrounding it. Then you make the linedefs that make up the bridge sector self referencing. That sounds a bit complicated, and I didn't understand it at first myself, either. Essentially with Wauth you highlight the sector and see what number it has. Then select each of the linedefs that make up this sector and there should be an entry that says "Sector" with a number next to it. Make that number for the front AND back of the linedef the same number as the sector and you should be all set.

I believe that was what you were having problems with at any rate.

Also, if you want it even easier, you don't even have to bother with making the sectors invisible and you can simply use Boom's deep water effect (I believe all source ports support Boom features now) and have the floor and ceiling of the dummy sector the same as the sector that surrounds the bridge. Any sectors that get raised above the fake floor (whichin this case is even with the regular floor) will be invisible. This also works better for stuff in opengl since the original doom2.exe tricks usually look funny in opengl.

And finally, for an even EASIER time you can use ZDoom's invisible bridge things and completly eliminate the need for any sort of instant movement sectors.

Whew that was a long post.

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That last suggestion of Cyb's is really the best, because you can make a 3D bridge that different players can walk over and under at the same time.

Here's a couple of screenshots of one of mine:

Screenshot 1
Screenshot 2

You can even make it completely invisible, but mark it with candles, torches, etc. You can even set those platforms at any height, allowing you make stairs. Here's an example:

Screenshot 3

The only down side is that you cannot adjust their height once you start the game with special commands like Floor_LowerToLowest or whatever. It will always stay at that height.

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Well, you could use thing_destroy and thing_spawn with acs and build a new bridge at a different height, or even wreck the current one so to speak, though it starts to get a bit complicated, but it can be done.

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Cyb said:

Well, you could use thing_destroy and thing_spawn with acs and build a new bridge at a different height, or even wreck the current one so to speak, though it starts to get a bit complicated, but it can be done.


I tried that a while back, but the bridge thing isn't spawnable. You can try T_BRIDGE, but you get a 'gross hack' icon when you spawn that.

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Then try replacing a sprite with an invisible platform and use Thing_Spawn to create the bridge out of that.

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Thanks for that, guys. I'll give some of the suggestions a try and let you know how I get on.

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Ultimate DooMer said:

I tried that a while back, but the bridge thing isn't spawnable. You can try T_BRIDGE, but you get a 'gross hack' icon when you spawn that.


Ahhh! but everything is spawnable! :-)

First, the GROSS HACK bridge is something that has been kicking around for ages in Zdoom (maybe since ver 1.17 - although it was undocumented - I found it by accident when looking through a DeePsea config file where it was mentioned, but commented out). It is an item that you can place in a map using editnum 118 and IIRC its size is rad 32, height 4. If you want to use it, just replace the GROSS HACK graphics in your wad with something more suitable (eg invisible sprites). The GROSS HACK graphics are in Zdoom.wad if you want to look in there and get their names. If you use visible graphics, you will find that the bridge is drawn fullbright and cycles through the gross hack graphics quite quickly.

All the other bridge types are spawnable too if you use the spawnspot command in Zdoom 2. The big difference here is that items spawned using spawnspot need to have enough room to come into your level without touching anything else. So you'd have to make sure there was enough room round your mapspot to allow the bridge to spawn without coming into contact with a wall, another bridge or any other solid item.

The format is

Spawnspot ("Actor", tid, newtid, angle);

Actor is any valid actor name, tid is the tid of the spot where the item is to be spawned, newtid is the tid you want to give the new item (often just 0) and angle is the angle the item will face (irrelevant for the bridge).

To find a list of valid actors, go to the console and type

logfile log.txt
dumpclasses actor


Then quit Zdoom. You'll find a file (log.txt) in your Zdoom directory with all the actor names in it. I think these are the ones that may interest you.


InvisibleBridge
InvisibleBridge32
InvisibleBridge16
InvisibleBridge8

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Enjay said:

Ahhh! but everything is spawnable! :-)


In which case, how do I spawn baron and mancubus fireballs using Thing_Projectile? (and is there any way to define them in the zdefs.acs, as they're not in there)

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Also with zdoom you can use the transfer floor heights (deep water effect) effect to create a solid floor for the bridge. Its been used in some of the rescent maps eg 007ltsd by Ultimate DooMer.

The only annoying thing with zdooms invisible bridges is you fall through it when you die (looks bad in deathmatch) and monsters don't use them.

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Szymanski said:

The only annoying thing with zdooms invisible bridges is you fall through it when you die (looks bad in deathmatch) and monsters don't use them.

Also, you can shoot trough them with hitscan weapons (pistol, shotgun...) and so can enemies.

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Thanks, Cyb! It was the linedef referencing that was stopping it working. You've made a frustrated editor very happy.

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Ultimate DooMer said:

In which case, how do I spawn baron and mancubus fireballs using Thing_Projectile? (and is there any way to define them in the zdefs.acs, as they're not in there)


Hah! I only said they were spawnable, not that they would be any use once they were spawned. ;-P

Spawnspot only spawns things as stationary items so it's pretty useless for fireballs, and a few items will spawn and then cause a crash (eg I think the Hexen Mage Super weapon fireballs do that - at least they did a few versions ago). It might be possible to spawn an item with a tid using spawnspot and then thrust it, but that sounds unlikely to work, and I have no idea if the item would even still behave like a true projectile under those conditions.

There is some good news though, the mancubus shot should be spawnable now. This is from Randy's changelog:

"Gave the fatso's fireball spawnid 153. In zdefs.acs, T_CACODEMONSHOT was incorrectly named T_MANCUBUSSHOT."

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If you want to spawn fireballs and other things like that, use Thing_Projectile and Thing_ProjectileGravity.

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Enjay said:

There is some good news though, the mancubus shot should be spawnable now. This is from Randy's changelog:

"Gave the fatso's fireball spawnid 153. In zdefs.acs, T_CACODEMONSHOT was incorrectly named T_MANCUBUSSHOT."


Will this only work on the newest version of ZDoom? (it doesn't on 1.23b33) And is it possible to spawn the baron fireball, as I'll need that for my new project as well.

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Ultimate DooMer said:

Will this only work on the newest version of ZDoom?

...is it possible to spawn the baron fireball


Yes, you'll need at least Zdoom 2.0.36 to recognise the new mancubus fireball spawn number, and no, I don't think it is possible to spawn the Baron fireball using Thing_Projectile, even with 2.0.36

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