OBLIGE 3.39 Released

Note: toughness_factor will make tougher (harder) monsters, not necessarily more monsters (possibly less).

Quantities are controlled by the MONSTER_QUANTITES table in scripts/monsters.lua and looks like this:

  local MONSTER_QUANTITIES =
  {
     scarce=11, less=18, normal=25, more=33, heaps=45
  }

Change heaps to 95 and see what happens :D

P.S. I think I'll spread those numbers out a bit more, e.g. 10/16/25/37/55.

I tried it at 150 for heaps, and at most I usually ended up with 1,500 thousand monsters per map, but the quality of the maps took a hit. (I know, I tend to go overboard sometimes.)

Hopefully, there'll be a way to choose which types of monsters can spawn on the menu in the next version.

gun_psycho said:

but the quality of the maps took a hit. (I know, I tend to go overboard sometimes.)

How so? I'm curious.

gun_psycho said:

@Johnny: Should the E*M8 maps have certain combination of words like E2M8 having "Tower of <insert noun here>"?

I suggested map names limited to boss battles earlier. Currently there isn't a way to do that, however "Tower of" map names are likely to be generated for any Hell themed maps, regardless of whether its a boss battle. My intention so far were to include many more "complete level names" as well a bunch of other words to be used in the generator.

EDIT: Here's some more skies. Ya now got Reddish clouds (a little less saturated red) White Clouds, Peach Clouds, Brown Clouds, Brownish Clouds (a little lighter and more grayish) Green Clouds, Greenish Clouds (More grayish) Yellow Clouds, and an experiment that I haven't yet tested, but it's supposed to look like a black sky with scattered dark red clouds around. Hopefully it looks good. I want to try and utilize purple as a sky color too, I'll mix around with some grays and blacks and maybe some reds and we'll see what happens.

Rename sky_gen.txt to sky_gen.lua

What else is changeable through the .LUAs as of 3.39? I like tweaking stuff around.

@JohnnyRancid - Well, I'm pretty much the type of doomer who enjoys fighting through maps filled with tons of monsters. (even if the numbers are in the thousands)

Anyways, my last suggestion is being able to add more custom modules. Would one with random monsters without changing the LUA file count as one?

I'm thinking about generating a megawad of all "Large" sized levels and setting the monster quantity to something like 240 for a complete nuts.wad megawad heh

Ajapted said:

Note: toughness_factor will make tougher (harder) monsters, not necessarily more monsters (possibly less).

Quantities are controlled by the MONSTER_QUANTITES table in scripts/monsters.lua and looks like this:

  local MONSTER_QUANTITIES =
  {
     scarce=11, less=18, normal=25, more=33, heaps=45
  }

Change heaps to 95 and see what happens :D

P.S. I think I'll spread those numbers out a bit more, e.g. 10/16/25/37/55.

Ahhh, no wonder I was seeing more tough monsters! I see the cruise control for more badguys now. :D More monsters = more potential for infight = more hilarity and ammo conservation.

I find the presence of 4 cyberdemons on MAP30 a bit overpowering, maybe change them to Barons?

Also, how does one get to MAP31 and MAP32 in 3.39 for the time being?

On the monster quantity code, this is what it looks like on my monster.lua file now...

local MONSTER_QUANTITIES =
  {
     scarce=10, less=22, normal=35, more=45, heaps=67
  }

Mr. Chris said:

I find the presence of 4 cyberdemons on MAP30 a bit overpowering, maybe change them to Barons?

Make more generic boss battle maps so that one shows up less often.

I'm very close to finished with the mapname generator. I still have to change the probability of some words. Tech and Hell are pretty much finished. Urban is especially difficult because it combines haunted city style names, with castles and geographic areas too. So too often map names like "The Abandoned River" come up, which is dumb. I'll come up with some kind of workaround.

I only am saying this about the cyberdemons because it's pretty hard to get to that pedestal when you have 12 rockets coming at you from all four corners, not to mention splash damage that chips away at the player's health, and little cover for revenant homing rockets as well.

I think the level arena should be larger so the player is able to dodge explosive projectiles, similar in width the original id MAP30 is.

Since I've never made a MAP30 style map, I will give the task for anyone else who wants to try, but I'm also willing to make a better looking MAP07 (a smaller DOOM2.WAD style one and a larger version with more monsters) if Ajapted wants me to. :3

JohnnyRancid said:

What else is changeable through the .LUAs as of 3.39?

Colors for level names (see COMMON_LEVEL_GFX_COLORS in doom1.lua)

Colors for Oblige logos (see Doom_make_cool_gfx in doom1.lua)

In scripts/defs.lua there is some stuff for choosing room sizes, e.g. BIG_ROOM_TABLE has probabilities of creating really large rooms. (Other stuff like MONSTER_QUANTITIES will move in defs.lua eventually)

BTW I will check out your new skies soon. Actually I've been considering removing the sky generator, make it a separate program and simply load skies from a WAD in the data/ folder.

Re: MAP30
It's meant to be hard to get on the platform, since once you do it's just a few rockets into the demon face and game over. Other stuff would be possible, I just had a few ideas like having to completely kill a Cybie standing in the way (and cannot move), or having to kill a bunch of barons each guarding a switch which lowers a blocking pillar.

Exits to secret levels are not added yet.

Do you think it would be a good idea to seperate the URBAN theme to URBAN and NATURE? That way I can include more geological landform style words in the map generator and not worry about the adjectives and nouns that are used specifically for cities/castles getting intertwined with the words that are specifically for mountains and rivers and stuff? Natural maps would have a lot of outdoor areas, liquid dropoffs and caves, while Urban maps would be more reminiscent to the Tech theme by looking more man-made.

Or maybe I should just scrap the geological words altogether? Because it's likely that even if a mapname does have the words "Cliffs" or "Canyon" or "River" it probably won't have a cliff, canyon, or river in it at all, unless the map generating code already has this in store?

Re: Re: MAP30: The other problem is that isn't enough ammo to kill all 4 cyberdemons and any accompanying monsters spawned by the Boss Brain as well as shooting spare rockets to kill it. Until a larger and/or better MAP30 is implemented, it will do.

I like the idea keeping URBAN and NATURE seperate, since nature could be considered a subtheme at most when going from indoor -> outdoor -> indoor and such.

An option for adjustable rooms types, like a "Favourite" room type, which the program will pick more often, like Small Room, Med Room, Big Room, Corridor, Crossroads etc.

Personally, I like small and medium rooms the best with the occasional huge/crossroad/etc type rooms.

Would it be possible to have giant rooms to have 6 or more connections (including teleporters) somehow in the future?

The 'URBAN' theme is not terribly well defined (like TECH and HELL). I think it will mostly be man-made buildings (for example BRICK#, WOOD#, STONE#) with natural surrounds (FWATER, GRASS etc), and _occasionally_ maps might be completely caves / outdoor stuff.

So it makes sense to remove the geographical words.

re: rooms with 6+ connections
They are a bit of a problem, because the path through the level will only use two connections, entry and exit, hence all the other connections (unless they are locked doors) will go to dead-ends.

I'm guessing if you have 2 doors on each wall using thin/small halls/rooms and possibly blocked off teleporters (switch quest) in the corner(s) that would take the player somewhere on the map (IE the telejump on id's MAP15)

I made a bigger and better MAP07, btw. :3

I also think ZDoom and Skulltag both support linedef actions that makes doors require more than one or all 3 keys..let me dig around to see what info there is on this.

Hmmmmm...

http://zdoom.org/wiki/Key_types
http://zdoom.org/wiki/LOCKDEFS

For ZDoom and Skulltag, I think one might have to mess around with LOCKDEFS or something to make a door needing 3 or even all 6 keys. If I am wrong, feel free to correct me.

Or you could just use the Boom generalized locked doors that nearly every port supports nowadays...

Might there be a page with ALL Boom generalized linedefs, their linedef action #s and what they do, essel?

Well, I'm not Essel, however, I can point you in the direction where to find it.

ftp://ftp.fu-berlin.de/pc/msdos/games/idgames//themes/TeamTNT/boom/boom202.zip

Download boom202, extract it and read boomref.txt

:)

I see the entries in boomref.txt but it has no mention of linedef action number..

Generalized Door Types
---------------------------------------------------------------
#        Class   Trig   Lock   Speed    Wait  Monst    Function

3C00H-   Gen     P1/PR  No     Slow     1s    Yes      Open, Wait, Then Close
4000H            S1/SR         Normal   4s    No       Open and Stay Open
                 W1/WR         Fast     9s             Close and Stay Closed
                 G1/GR         Turbo    30s            Close, Wait, Then Open
                        

Generalized Locked Door Types
---------------------------------------------------------------
#        Class   Trig   Lock   Speed    Wait  Monst    Function

3800H-   Gen     P1/PR  Any    Slow     1s    No       Open, Wait, Then Close
3C00H            S1/SR  Blue   Normal   4s             Open and Stay Open
                 W1/WR  Red    Fast     9s             Close and Stay Closed
                 G1/GR  Yell   Turbo    30s            Close, Wait, Then Open
                        BlueC
                        RedC
                        YellC
                        BlueS
                        RedS
                        YellS
                        All3
                        All6

Type            Start      Length   (Dec)
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Floors          0x6000     0x2000  (8192)
Ceilings        0x4000     0x2000  (8192)
Doors           0x3c00     0x0400  (1024)
Locked Doors    0x3800     0x0400  (1024)
Lifts           0x3400     0x0400  (1024)
Stairs          0x3000     0x0400  (1024)
Crushers        0x2F80     0x0080   (128)
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Totals:  0x2f80-0x7fff     0x5080  (20608)

Where might these linedef numbers be so it could be used for Oblige's locked doors?

PS: Sorry for taking this thread slightly off-topic, Andrew. :)

On the addition of custom monsters, I have not seen the Cybruiser or the Archon spawn at all in the current version despite they worked with 0.97 and spawned properly. Here's the code I use, which is basically a cut/paste of existing entries and modified below..

In DOOM_THINGS:

  archon  = { id=30104, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 },
  cybruiser = { id=30128, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 },

In COMMON_MONSTERS:

  archon =
  {
    prob=10, guard_prob=30, trap_prob=41, cage_prob=10,
    health=1500, damage=99, attack="missile",
  },

In DOOM2_MONSTERS:

  cybruiser =
  {
    prob=16, guard_prob=41, trap_prob=41, cage_prob=11,
    health=2000, damage=70, attack="missile",
  },

Might I be doing something wrong? Every other custom monster spawns properly in this list except the notes on the two:

--- Skulltag specific monsters ---
  abaddon  = { id=5015,kind="monster", r=31,h=56 },
  hectebus  = { id=5007, kind="monster", r=48,h=64 },
  superguy = { id=5005, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  cacolant   = { id=5006,kind="monster", r=31,h=56 },
  belphegor  = { id=5008, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 },
  bldemon    = { id=5004,kind="monster", r=30,h=56 },
  darkimp    = { id=5003,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
--- End Skulltag specific monsters ---

--- Realm667 beastiary ---
  plasmaguy = { id=3205, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  rocketguy = { id=3202, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  suicideguy = { id=22099, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  inferno  = { id=30105,kind="monster", r=31,h=56 },
  archon  = { id=30104, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 }, --Not spawning?
  afrit  = { id=3120, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 },
  cybaron = { id=10000, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 },
  cybruiser = { id=30128, kind="monster", r=24,h=64 }, --Not spawning?
  gunner2 = { id=30124, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  stoneimp = { id=3103,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  fusion    = { id=20000, kind="monster", r=66,h=64 },
  zombie2    = { id=3201,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  chainsawguy  = { id=3204,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  tortsoul  = { id=3122,kind="monster", r=31,h=56 },
  chainarach = { id=12456,  kind="monster", r=66,h=64 },
  zsec    = { id=6699,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  zombie3    = { id=3200,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  defiler  = { id=9654 ,kind="monster", r=31,h=56 },
  nailborg    = { id=27800,kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  satyr       = { id=3109,kind="monster", r=18,h=48 },
  stonedemon  = { id=31999,kind="monster", r=30,h=56 },
  tornado     = { id=32725, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
  diabloist = { id=30112, kind="monster", r=20,h=56 },
--- End Realm667 beastiary ---

Oh yea, you might want to make the bfg10k weapon set to hitscan since the blasts hit the nearest solid object(s) upon using it.

Ajapted said:

BTW I will check out your new skies soon. Actually I've been considering removing the sky generator, make it a separate program and simply load skies from a WAD in the data/ folder.

Wait, like a resource wad of skies, and oblige will just pick a few? In theory you could do this for music, texture, titlepic/interpic resources too, right?

@Mr. Chris: The # 3800H-3C00H range actually is the range of trigger numbers for generalized locked doors, only there it's represented in hex rather than the numbers we're used to seeing. Because standard Doom map format doesn't have any place for line triggers to take parameters like Hexen does, the Boom generalized linetypes use an entire range of numbers to account for all the possible combinations, with the trigger number being calculated based on the parameters you choose. If you edit a linedef in Doom Builder's Boom configuration and look at the Generalized tab of the linedef actions dialog, it'll present you with the different types of generalized lines and the parameters they take. Based on your choices, it'll calculate the trigger number corresponding to the parameters you specified.

Edit: Cybruiser has shown up, don't know why he never showed up after some minor editing of the LUA file.

JohnnyRancid said:

Wait, like a resource wad of skies, and oblige will just pick a few? In theory you could do this for music, texture, titlepic/interpic resources too, right?

Yes absolutely, I'd like OBLIGE to ship with more custom resources in the future, and more importantly the ability of modules to supply their own resources.

@Chris: monsters don't show up for two reasons:
1) because they would take too long to kill (over 12 seconds) with the player's best weapon,
2) they would cause too much damage to the player (over 200 hp) while killing it

Search doom2.lua for "mon_time_max" and "mon_damage_max" values.

Alternatively, try lower values for their health.

Ajapted said:

Yes absolutely, I'd like OBLIGE to ship with more custom resources in the future, and more importantly the ability of modules to supply their own resources.

Sexy! I'm excited. I'm looking forward to nabbing a couple texture resources from the afterglow, throw em in the data folder, and get a fresh new look! (Given that I write the texture definitions for it)

This is gonna be niceeee.

Mm, I think it's because I dropped the health from 2000 to 1500 and reduced the damage on the setting. The archon's comet does as much damage as a standard rocket (along with a large splash range) and also has two other multi-spread missile attacks. The Cybruiser has 3 missile barrage and standard melee attack.

To even think I almost implemented a 7000 HP custom monster (Terminator on Realm667's beastiary) which has hitscan, missile and melee attacks.

Might I ask what does never_promote do?

Is this material system I see (as following the Sourceforge activity) based along the matching of floor/ceiling and wall texturess?

Mr. Chris said:

Is this material system I see (as following the Sourceforge activity) based along the matching of floor/ceiling and wall texturess?

Yes, the closest flat for each texture, and the closest texture for each flat.

never_promote stops a monster from being "promoted", which means it appears in the level a lot more often than it normally would.

Mmm, I see now...I better add that to the Diabloist and Defiler >.>

Why? Because the Diabloist has the arch-vile attack that drains health while on the player AND has a pretty nasty multi-missile attack, while the Defiler has two missile attacks, can raise the dead and its body spews projectiles in numerous directions when killed.

:)

Umm, what settings do I need to edit to get Cyberdemons and Spider-masterminds to spawn? I've only managed to get 1 spider mastermind spawn out of 1000+ enemies :S

Try this, this should work:

  Mastermind =
  {
    prob=6, guard_prob=41, trap_prob=41, cage_prob=0,
    health=1500, damage=100, attack="hitscan",
  },

  Cyberdemon =
  {
    prob=5, guard_prob=41, trap_prob=41, cage_prob=0,
    health=1500, damage=100, attack="missile",
  },

The lower health and damage is to trick the program that they are more easily defeated (as stated by Ajapted above).