absolute least favorite maps in doom or doom 2?

(The Ultimate) DOOM:

E1M6: I want to skip it, but play it anyways and end up having fun, actually.
E2M5: big and boring.
E3M5: I get lost there and boring.
E3M7: what lupinx-Kassman said.

DOOM II:

Map 19: I get lost there.

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E1M6 is surely long-paced but at least somehow enjoyable, dismentioning that weirdly acting last-before-last door which makes way into the high-tech room.

Demons on the Prey is not valinly my least favourite soundtrack. Not only they have used it thrice (or four times if considering UD), but it's also featuring maps in which getting lost is usual as eating dinner. As Hectic mentioned it above.

E3M5 has also that not-even-marked secret yellow key door which does have some stuff in there, but the entire secret's realisation is just nonsense - may it be inspiring those 120-feet-high doors which were quite usual in the 1994-1995 Wads.

I could mark E4M1 as one of my least favourite maps, too. Getting just started, but being ambushed by 4 barons on the easiest difficulty is quite an experience which is in rivalry of the most undesirable ones. NIN proved me that not even secrets are all candy and whippy cake.

Same for the E4M2 Cyber, but at least it has a not-that-secret method to deal with. The E4M6 one, however, really pisses me off. Even if the red skull can help players what to do, that nasty bastard can still snipe and slaughter you, depending on more of luck than dexterity.

DOOM II: well, at least these maps are not that hateful. Disregarding some of them makes the levelset look more than prettily correct. However...

MAP12: the entire map seems to have three major sea levels.
MAP16: an E3M6 experience realised in a less appropriate way. The exit is also quite obscure.
MAP19: Hectic made a point out of this. I should add that the entire texturing and shaping design is rather abstract, and the blue key needs at least 3 secret areas to be visited (what if the blue bar was in the middle?!)
MAP21: as obvious...
MAP23: The barrels are somewhat good for a challenge, but the architecture is pretty dull and bland.
MAP24: Great contrast between high and low places. Maybe a bit too great. That's what it makes it awful.
Secret maps: I've already told my opinion in the other thread "If Doom II had real secret levels".

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DuckReconMajor said:

um lots of people love the chasm fuckin read threads man


lololol i see most of them dislike da chasm why not become angry

Aside from that.

Cell said:

MAP24: Great contrast between high and low places. Maybe a bit too great. That's what it makes it awful.


I can see it is just a small excuse to hate this map. In fact this what made it great, plus non-linearity.

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C30N9 said:

lololol i see most of them dislike da chasm why not become angry


Well I count 5 people hating it and 6 people (including myself) loving it so far.

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Tetzlaff said:

Well I count 5 people hating it and 6 people (including myself) loving it so far.


You didn't include haters at an other old thread.

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Cell said:

MAP19: Hectic made a point out of this. I should add that the entire texturing and shaping design is rather abstract, and the blue key needs at least 3 secret areas to be visited (what if the blue bar was in the middle?!)


"what if" shouldn't matter here. The blue bar wasn't in the middle probably for this exact reason. The yellow bar, which happens to be the easiest key to grab in that map, is.

Also, I can't be the the only one who views The Chasm as shrug-worthy, can I?

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I'm not actually hating MAP24. Here are my good points:

- you can learn tighrope-walking
- neatly hidden secrets with all those CONS1_* thingies
- the blue room with the red key at the end was actually a quite nice point of the map
- at least if you reach the inner stuff, you're not supposed to fear about falling into the pit anymore.

Still, somehow it just pisses me off. Maybe because it's a pain in the ass to achieve 3x100% at the end.

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E1M7 I don't like much, I always get lost there.
E3M7 is kind of a mixed bag, it's good for a casual playthrough but it's so easy to get lost.
MAP19 is cute with needing only two keycards out of three to complete, but I always get lost there. The map as a whole would fit the slot of MAP20 more, I think. And I do know I don't tend to like maps where I get lost.
MAP21 is ugly, nonsensical and broken. You can easily slip through one of the keycard bars, it's like they didn't even test it. And what the hell's up with the windows near the exit portal?

The Chasm is a mixed bag too. On one hand there are cool and unusual areas, like the slime room, the silver and blue spectre room and the computer room but the gimmick, thin walkways, was taken too far.

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yellowmadness54 said:
Are there maps in doom or doom 2 you just can't stand?

Just maps that turn you off entirely or you just skip?

Nope, I'm fond of all of them. Some are more impressive or well made than others but there's nothing that annoys me.

lupinx-Kassman said:
Did people honestly like E3M7? I felt it was pretty anticlimactic, being a giant (for the time) map with only 36 relatively weak monsters. The damaging blood was more threatening than the opposition, mainly due to the annoying teleporter puzzle that has you running back and forth just to hit some skull switches. Switches that serve little purpose other than to just artificially lengthen the map. Wasn't much to look at either, probably ranking the barest to the bone map in episode 3.

Like you imply, the damaging blood enhances the difficulty, and accessing the teleporters works well with the number of roaming monsters. It gets particularly exciting if one rushes it (why wouldn't one, after being familiar enough with the levels, even if one doesn't really speedrun?) or with respawning monsters, as you need to cross those areas more than once.

Marcaek said:
And then there's that retarded key puzzle at the end :|

It's not really a puzzle except in that the small room is hidden (although right across the door, making it a place where one would naturally search for a secret.) Most maps use the keys to make the player wander about in search for them. Here they are used together to stall progress and force the player to fight. Many of us can exit quickly anyway, but that just says how much playing skill has progressed and in different ways affects the bulk of the levels.

Hellbent said:
Of all the maps, it's probably E4M6.

Has to be the most annoyingly hardest map in both games with a possible exception of map30.

It's about as hard as e4m2, or maybe a bit less once one has a route in mind. It's just bigger, so it might intimidate people initially.

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E3M7 is absolutely annoying. i just hate wandering through the slime to find the skull switches. as regards doom 2, i agree with those who hate map05. oh and map 30 also. i'd have preferred a real final boss, and i hate the fact every megawad i try has the icon of sin as its final boss as well.

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Doom 1 I really hate ''Halls of the damned''
Doom 2 I hate the maps: the chasm, the factory and tenements

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Doom
E3M5: Teleporters really annoy me, and the rest of the level is pretty dull as well
E3M7: Pretty dull and unremarkable for the penultimate level
E3M8: Pointless level, way too damn easy.
E4M4: Just seems really out of place after E4M1, E4M2 and E4M3. Small and unchallenging.

Doom II
Level 7 - That every megawad seems to base their level 7 on this one may have a bearing on my inclusion of this level, but its just so unremarkable imo
Level 12 - Just boring
Level 13 - Long and a pain to speedrun
Level 24 - The thin walkways annoy the hell out of me, rest of the level isn't too bad to be fair
Level 32 - Lame secret level

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skaman86 said:

Doom: E3M1
Doom 2: The Chasm



amen. i tried to imagine playing through all d1/d2 maps rather than making a quick post, but no other maps stood out so clearly.

e3m1 has that bad start (pistol vs caco) and, to top it off, a corridor whit pinkies as cannon fodder and you can't even get past them.

the chasm... well, i just hate maps where you can fall down at every step. especially when you can't figure out where to go, and can't look down.

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Pirx said:

e3m1 has that bad start (pistol vs caco) and, to top it off, a corridor whit pinkies as cannon fodder and you can't even get past them.

Use the imps to soften the cacos a bit through infighting. Once the imps are dead, shoot the cacos. Punch the demons. You can't get past them, but they likewise can't get past you and mob you.

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The only maps that come to mind are:

E3M8: It's a joke, especially for the final map in the game. If you get there after having played the entire episode it's completable in less than 10 seconds without breaking any sweat and even if you go for 100% kills it's over in half a minute at most. E3M7 contains so much cells that you can just fire away with the BFG at will.

MAP21: Ugliest map in the IWADs. Just a random mishmash of disjointed styles and it plays like crap.

MAP30: A single room. A huge face. A small hole. A tall pillar... Enough said.

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If we're counting Plutonia, I hate Map11 - Hunted with a fiery burning passion.

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If we're counting Plutonia, I hate Map11 - Hunted with a fiery burning passion.


I love that map, very funny. Maybe you just can't deal with archviles. They are so sweet. And they say their "argggh-arrgggh-aaarghh" so funny. Just love them.

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I never skip levels, but here are the ones that I hate the most:

Ultimate Doom:

E2M9: Disappointingly short for a secret level.
E3M5: That teleporting puzzle is extremely annoying.
E3M8: Ant-climatic final level.
E4M4: Too easy and short compared to the previous maps.

Doom2:

MAP08: Too gimmicky for a serious level.
MAP09: Extremely ugly. Looks like Sandy Petersen pulled it out of his own ass.
MAP12: ...zzz...
MAP16: Nearly as ugly as MAP09, but unlike that map, this one's boring.
MAP21: ...
MAP24: Some areas are very cool, and most of the level looks very good, but it's all ruined by that shitty-ass gimmick.

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E2M9: simple and out of e2 theme
E3M8: maybe a bit more detail and more monsters could've saved it
E4M3: crappy wood looking
E4M5: all the same texture. boring

MAP14: all the same texture, boring, it gives me thirst
MAP22: ugly looking and small
MAP25: same as map22 but a little better
MAP32: worst than the shittiest 1994 wad

I don't like plutonia, yes... I've committed heresy.

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E2M9 would have worked much better as a secret area in a larger level. It's a weak excuse for an actual secret level. There are levels I hate when I get to them but I'll be damned if I can think of em. I should probly put this in the Doom confessional booth but I can never remember which maps are which. When I play the levels I remember them and remember the layouts and secrets etc, but just sitting here discussing and someone mentions a level name, I have a hard time thinking what level they're talking about. If I'm interested enough I'll load it up real quick just to see.

Ugh, I suck.

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40oz said:

I found the baron usage questionable in E4M2, which would have otherwise have been an awesome map. Not to say It's not awesome because of it but barons were used in places where they simply were annoying to fight. The plasma gun ledge, the yellow key switch, and at the bottom of that ledge in that SP_ROCK cave, especially since a good melee hit will level you in a single blow.

Yes but:
- you're given enough cells to kill them all
- even if you die, you won't lose much, after the hellhole of E4M1.

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The more I play Doom 2, the less I like it. I`m really starting to dislike MOST of the maps, and several are already in the "so bad I skip them or quit the game" category.

Ugh.

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Agreed with previous comment.

Doom levels are too simple, too small and too predictable and boring, compared to modern hardcore wads.

They are quite playable on Nightmare though, but playing in on Nightmare is more like a hard everyday job than playing for fun.

I have to confess, that I haven't played classic Doom & Doom II maps last year at all. And I guess I don't want to.

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After playing all the way through Ultimate Doom just recently for an LP, I can really appreciate every level just a little bit more. None that I totally hate, though Unholy Cathedral gets a bit tedious.

And I can't really think of a bad map in Doom 2. Icon of Sin is about the only bothersome one and I still enjoy it as a good arena style map.

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nicolas monti said:

E4M3: crappy wood looking
E4M5: all the same texture. boring

MAP14: all the same texture, boring, it gives me thirst

E4M3: 90% WOOD1, 7% SUPPORT3, 3% other... (flats: 35% FLAT5_1, 35% FLAT5_2, 25% FLAT5_4, 5% other...)
E4M5: 90% GSTONE1/GSTONE2, 8% SUPPORT3, 2% other...
MAP14: 80% BSTONE1/2, 10% SUPPORT3, 9% BIGBRIK2, 1% other...

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E2M2: If I wanted to wander through a maze, I'd play Wolf3D.

E2M4: On its own the level isn't bad, but the difficulty is so much harder than the ones that come before and after it that it that it trashes any sense of progression.

E4M2: I don't mind the "platforms over rivers of lava" theme of Doom 2's The Chasm and other levels, but this map takes things too far. Not only do you have to watch your step, but you have to fight in tight corners too, making dodging attacks without going in the lava almost impossible.

E4M6: This map skips the platforming of E4M2 and just has you slog through the lava from the start. Challenge is fine, but when most of that challenge is forcing you to take damage, something's wrong.

MAP13: A good idea done badly.

If I can include maps from TNT on here:

MAP11: Oh goody, another crate maze.

MAP24: Few monsters, bland environment, just disappointing all around.

MAP31: When you have to use noclip to beat the level, you've really screwed up.

Haven't played Plutonia in a while, so I don't remember its maps well enough to single any out.

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Gez said:

Use the imps to soften the cacos a bit through infighting. Once the imps are dead, shoot the cacos. Punch the demons. You can't get past them, but they likewise can't get past you and mob you.


I've played this a million bizzillion times and I haven't need to fist the demons since I don't know how far back. There is enough ammo for UV. And I tend to use the beserk pack for half of E3M2, but mainly because it's funner that way.

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