Eternal demos [-complevel 2]

Saw your run a few hours ago, really crazy route with rjumps, good job :D

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Yeah, well done there. I wasn't expecting something so quick given the descriptions of the length of the levels given by players on the RtO news/comments threads. But speeding jumps tend to surprise us like that, of course.

The gothic environment plus jumping made it feel almost like a Quake demo, heh!

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ED4:

MAP13 UV-Speed in 3:51 on ZDoom 2.1.7.

Also included two nomo runs. One of them was the original route I had planned, which includes a leisurely swim while I attempt to play the chainsaw.

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Very nice! I am looking forwards to map27 run - there is also plenty of rocket jumping possibilities :-)

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ED4 MAP13 UV-Speed in 1:14 on ZDoom 2.1.7.

I GOD moded through most of map27 and it's beautiful but feels scary to learn. It looks like you need all keys before you can activate the exit lines?

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Sounds like it'd be better for maxing than speeding.

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The demopack e3demos seems to need eternal.wad but idgames only have eternall.wad
The TeamTNT website have a link to the upgrade for eternal 2 but not the two first parts, it's confusing.

Anyway, I like your runs TimeOfDeath, when Eternal Doom IV will be complete I'll look forward for all your speedruns so 'quaky' :)

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K!r4 said:

The demopack e3demos seems to need eternal.wad but idgames only have eternall.wad
The TeamTNT website have a link to the upgrade for eternal 2 but not the two first parts, it's confusing.

The file on /idgames does give you eternal.wad, but you have to actually follow the installation instructions in order to generate it. Just read INSTALL.TXT.

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I tested this rigorously some time ago, but can't recall exactly. But I think all those demos will play back with eternall.wad too. And some require it.

My recollection is concluding that the recording team used only the stanadlone version, and not the one derived from upgrading. Edit: confirmed, with the additional comment that two of the demos (et30-nom.lmp and fireston.lmp) play back with no released version of the wad that I am aware of (I tried pretty much every possibility when I tested them some months ago).

Reckoner: The installation process makes the necessary changes to make it work with Doom2.exe, but gives you a wad called eternal.wad that is the same in terms of demo playback as eternall.wad. This is not the same as the wad created by using the upgrade patch. This all makes for a bit of a mess with naming, etc.

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Hmmm so maybe you should change the patterns because when I try to launch a demo from this pack it need eternal.
Thanks Reckoner, I thinked that the lot of files included in the zip has been only for to run with doom2.exe :P

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I did give this mess quite a bit of thought at the time I made the patterns in fact.

I'm sure a lot of people will have eternal.wad created by using the upgrade patch (and there are demos recorded using this version of the wad too). That's why I made it work the way it does, so that people who have both that and eternall.wad from the standalone version will find everything works fine.

If you want all Eternal demos to attempt to play back using just eternall.wad, then you can either edit the patterns accordingly, or make a copy of it called eternal.wad.

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You're right yeah... now I've both eternal and eternall in my directory, all is perfect :)
I've asked about because some pages before, it talk about some differences in maps between these versions :

Grazza said:

When the third and final release of Eternal was made, it was available in two forms. One was an upgrade patch that one applied to the previous release. The other was a standalone version (which includes the aforementioned eternall.wad).

They were presumably intended to produce an identical wad, but there are some slight differences in some of the maps, enough to cause demos to desync. I'm not sure of the exact details, but it would be easy enough to investigate - just try playing back the demos in the original demopack with both versions of the wad. Though I can say that there are differences in maps 10, 18, 20, 21, 23, 24 and 25 (there are demos on these maps that don't play back with eternal.wad, but do play back with eternall.wad).


I'll post here if something is wrong during my watching :)

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Grazza said:

confirmed, with the additional comment that two of the demos (et30-nom.lmp and fireston.lmp) play back with no released version of the wad that I am aware of (I tried pretty much every possibility when I tested them some months ago).

This may be old news, but I just found out there is nothing wrong with these two demos.

ET30-NOM is a -nomonster demo on the final level, where the player doesn't open the window/door to the Romero head, only shows where it is, then hits Q. Thus no victory screen (or tally screen in prBoom+).

In FIRESTON, the player hit Q before the tally screen came up. Add about 700 tics to the end of the .lmp and the tally screen completes with 94% kills, 100% items, 100% secrets and time 11:58.

Last, about the elusive EII release. I don't have Eternall II, but apparently the E3UPG upgrade can be performed on an Eternal III install. The install routine reported no errors and the resultant file ETERNAL.WAD is different from that produced by an installation from scratch. I don't know if it matches the file produced by upgrading a real Eternal II installation. Here are the filesizes

from scratch: 29,507,242
fake upgrade: 29,435,640

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Have you found that the one produced by using e3 upgrade on the e3 standalone leads to some desyncs in the relevant demos (see earlier in the thread for details)?

Can't easily test; not at home. But I would be very surprised if the e3 intsllation process led to the same difference in maps as are present in the e2->e3 upgrade method.

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Grazza said:

Have you found that the one produced by using e3 upgrade on the e3 standalone leads to some desyncs in the relevant demos (see earlier in the thread for details)?

I did the tests with the following demos, with your earlier post as the reference:

Grazza said:

I can say that there are differences in maps 10, 18, 20, 21, 23, 24 and 25 (there are demos on these maps that don't play back with eternal.wad, but do play back with eternall.wad).

CRIMSON
STANDS
SILURES
FIRESTON (with wait tics appended to enable tally screen)
TGATE2
RAINBOW
BEGINEND

They all reached the tally screen, using the End key in prBoom+ and the fake upgraded ETERNAL.WAD. Oddly enough, on the first try with CRIMSON the progress indicator in prBoom+ went all the way to the end but there was no tally screen. Subsequent attempts all finished successfully.

Grazza said:

Can't easily test; not at home. But I would be very surprised if the e3 installation process led to the same difference in maps as are present in the e2->e3 upgrade method.

Do the above demos desync with the properly upgraded ETERNAL.WAD? I cannot test because I don't have Eternal II. If they do, then the differences are indeed not the same.

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Playing through Eternal as of late and decided to do a quick UV-Max for map 26, one of my favorite maps from the wad in terms of gameplay and music. Time for the run comes out to 20:15. Some ugly mistakes in the run (Including an epic screw up involving a weapon switch), but still nearly 3 minutes quicker than the old record on this level.

Under 20 minutes should not be very hard to get.

et262015.zip

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Anima Zero said:

Playing through Eternal as of late and decided to do a quick UV-Max for map 26, one of my favorite maps from the wad in terms of gameplay and music.

I love that map too! It's always nice to see Eternal demos.

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Grazza said:

I love that map too! It's always nice to see Eternal demos.

Eternal is my absolutely favorite megawad. More demos please.

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Anima Zero said:

Playing through Eternal as of late and decided to do a quick UV-Max for map 26

Twenty minutes, fifteen seconds, and very few dull moments. Nice job, Anima!

I'd certainly love to see more. Why not give MAP20 another try. It's not like it's the most complicated level ever.:-)

Seriously...I think MAP30 is worse.

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Andy Olivera said:

Twenty minutes, fifteen seconds, and very few dull moments. Nice job, Anima!

I'd certainly love to see more. Why not give MAP20 another try. It's not like it's the most complicated level ever.:-)

Seriously...I think MAP30 is worse.

Oh yeah, I'll probably give map20 another go here. I just became fed up trying to figure out what little detail I missed to advance onwards :P.

In the meantime though, here's another Eternal UV-Max...it's for map28 in 10:15. Sub-10 might be possible here.

Also yay for getting lost for some brief moments. Very easy to do on this map.

et281015.zip

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Perfect timing, ToD! I've spent several hours over the last week with MAP11, alternating between staring at the map and banging my head on my desk. I just couldn't decide what route to take. Do I go with my gut and grab the keys in a sequence that lets me control the monsters(all the keys before entering either Blue Door, which releases all the monsters beyond)? Do I grab the Blue Key first and start moving forward immediately?

You know, non-linear levels are awesome...until you have to find the fastest way through them. Too many variables. In the end, I think I'll wind up picking one and hope it works.:-(

Oh, and terrific work with the demo, BTW. It's an enormous improvement over the old one.

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Yeah, that's all I did, "pick one and hope it works". I basically just used the speed route I used a couple years ago and made some detours to kill monsters/find secrets. I look forward to seeing your route. :)
Btw, I forgot to give credit to the nomo map11 demo author for jumping to the yellow key from the high area.

map24 max 20:43

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TimeOfDeath said:
Credit to Kai-Uwe for the idea of running past the first two cacos, killing the two revs on the high platforms at the start of the demo, and running into the water to lower the lift then press the hidden switch then go on the lift and clear the south-east section of the map then drop down onto the already raised lift in the east section that the hidden switch triggered.

:)))

To say it was excellent would be an understatement. I especially admired narrow ledge running. BTW, I never finished this map.

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vdgg said:

:)))

To say it was excellent would be an understatement. I especially admired narrow ledge running. BTW, I never finished this map.


Indeed. I absolutely detest the gameplay of Eternal and most of the wads that it inspired - Eternal Memories being the exception, of course. However, ToD's demos are an absolute pleasure to watch. :)

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with a bit longer txt files:

map12 max 16:04
map15 max 12:15
map30 max 17:10

vdgg said:

BTW, I never finished this map.

I never knew how to beat this map even with jumping, until after seeing Eugene's speed demo (he didn't use a map editor).

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Yeah, I had watched both UV Speeds, maybe gave up too soon. In MAP20 I didn't exit either, but at least I got very far (I guess I didn't know about the stump switch...)

As for the textfiles, this is my favourite part:
"When lowering that lift, there's a distant deaf caco (thing 117) that I try to wake up by him seeing me"

As for the demos, you're releasing them very quickly! MAP12 caught my attention, it is a very dramatic one, with low health all the time in the second half. In the first half, too, I noticed you killed a PE with rockets @14% health ignoring blast damage ;) Now, are you going to release a full Eternal demo pack or will limit yourself just to maps with cybers?

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