Questions about speedrunning

for some runs I am wondering if it is allowed...

1...to die in a coop run (no suicide exit, just normal dieing and respawning)
2...to do rocket jumps in UV Tyson or UV pacific (without harming any monster with it)
3...to do suicide exits in UV Tyson or UV pacific (without harming any monster with it)
4...to telefrag monsters in UV Tyson

would be nice if someone could share his answers with us/me

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2a. Tyson No. Is there any map in which this would be beneficial? Or a map in which normal Tyson would be impossible w/o rocket jumps? You may then specify this would be an "almost Tyson" with a restriction of using a rocket for jumping. Also, you can't use SSG for secrets such as in Doom II map 16 / MM2 MAP27. Generally, only "1", "2" weapons can be fired - pistol, fist, chainsaw.
2b. Pacifist Yes.
3. Yes. But not with rockets in Tyson. See Icarus MAP04 Pacifist for an example of a suicide without rockets.
4. Yes - see Plutonia MAP14 for a good example.

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I assume we're talking about the Compet-n standard. In that case:

1. No respawning is allowed, and if one of the players is dead at the end of the level the corpse must still be moving (this is to allow death exits in coop I believe).

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wow thank you a lot for such a fast and good answer! this helped me a lot

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If you have some cool idea for coop demo with respawns, don't mind the "official" rules, feel free to record it. ;) Just don't forget to explain your own rules in the *.txt so we can understand it better.

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Creaphis said:

1. No respawning is allowed, and if one of the players is dead at the end of the level the corpse must still be moving (this is to allow death exits in coop I believe).


How about map30 tyson co-op? There's no reliable way to do it without dying as far as I know. That must be an exception to the rule? :p

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Looper said:

How about map30 tyson co-op? There's no reliable way to do it without dying as far as I know. That must be an exception to the rule? :p


true, well I thats the way I understood it:
if someone dies, it is only ok, if he exited the level

@Memfis: I asked because there are VERY big maps out there (which take at least 1 hour) in which it would be cool if it is legal to respawn :D

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Looper said:

How about map30 tyson co-op? There's no reliable way to do it without dying as far as I know. That must be an exception to the rule? :p

I recall I asked AdamH about this kind of inconsistency - i.e. that for coop any corpses still had to be moving at the point where the map was exited (by his ruling) but that single-player map30 demos were routinely accepted where the player died and his corpse clearly stopped moving well before the last tic. He didn't give any clear answer, but it seemed that map30 was some kind of exception.

So perhaps the interpretation is that with a boss brain, any deaths are OK after the boss-brain explosion has been triggered. At least, that is consistent with previous practice. You'd think this should apply to coop too.

Of course, everyone is free to create new categories, such as "coop with respawning after deaths". But regular coop demos by convention do not feature this. As long as the demo is interesting and the category well-defined, you will find an audience.

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I did some deaths-allowed coop demos on wads designed for deaths. I *think* I remember some oldschool guys saying people used to submit coop demos with deaths to get faster times, but they were rejected. I'm not sure I understand why, since the level doesn't restart in coop it should be fair game to use deaths to get faster times, and "no-deaths" should be an optional category if it's slower.

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ok, good...
but another question cam into my mind :/:

if you want to do an arch-vile jump directly next to an arch-vile (so his attack hurts himself) is it then still UV pasific? (to make it more clear: I know this arch-vile jump will hurts him, which speaks agains UV pasific imo)

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IMO that's allowed because it's arch-viles fault. I mean you can intentionally let monsters shoot barrels so they suicide/harm itself.

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Looper said:

IMO that's allowed because it's arch-viles fault. I mean you can intentionally let monsters shoot barrels so they suicide/harm itself.


ok, thank you a lot!
now I can speedrun avj.wad a bit :D

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