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dew

d2shorts

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i had an idea to make a puzzle wad based on famous map exploits/tricks in doom2.wad. i am ridiculously bad at map editing and i steal small parts of iwad maps, so don't be shy to call me out. on the other hand i play it dirty and you will struggle to complete these maps. :p

right now it's just two maps based on doom2 map27 and map16. i plan to add more, but i need a big break after building a door for at least 15 minutes and aligning teleporter flats for another 2 hours. this is my first attempt at mapping and it's so bad... anyways.

all of the maps should be possible to speedrun or max. the means to it differ greatly depending on difficulty. anyone should be able to complete HNTR and HMP is still within reach of players with some knowledge of doom engine exploits, although some studying of the maps in an editor might be necessary. the difficulty i planned for originally is UV with Boom features, this is where only the strongest and wisest will prevail. :p regular vanilla doom2 UV is crazy hard, although still supported and theoretically possible.

current wip:
http://www.mediafire.com/?y5v5gvdva6txylr

please don't yell at me for being totally incompetent at texturing.

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EDIT:

original links are dead, so i reuploaded what i could find.

d2shorts: http://www.mediafire.com/?q9luv5l753tf3f5
ggg's solutions for d2shorts: http://www.mediafire.com/?xssdc7bd8af0sj4
ggg's trick1 wad (with solution): http://www.mediafire.com/?md7mu7nrbakb9eu

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Unless I'm missing something, there appears to be a problem with map 16.

The red skullkey is near the exit lines, and the player needs the red skullkey to open sector 9. It appears to me impossible to obtain the key since teleporting from line 78, the player arrives at coordinates x 1024 y 944 ( T64 ).

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Mapping isn't too hard. Make a couple practice maps by messing around with editor functions and you'll be on your way :)

When it comes to aligning flats, set the map grid to 64x64, and build your teleporter pads with that. Flats align to the 64x64 grid and afaik you can't really do anything about it unless you make a custom flat.

I'll give this a go tomorrow.

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hawkwind: note dew's comments in his first paragraph:

dew said:

I had an idea to make a puzzle wad based on famous map exploits/tricks in doom2.wad.

That is, the whole point of this wad is to present the player with challenges based on speedrunning tricks that exploit quirks and glitches in the Doom code. The maps aren't intended to be readily completable by normal means.

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hawkwind said:

The red skullkey is near the exit lines, and the player needs the red skullkey to open sector 9. It appears to me impossible to obtain the key since teleporting from line 78, the player arrives at coordinates x 1024 y 944 ( T64 ).

just hold forward after teleporting. :)

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I could only do 16 skill 3 and 27 skill 2:
http://www.mediafire.com/?l5kvl2s26w40zoq
That's only maybe the 2nd glide I've ever done and had to use the mouse (keyboarder usually).

Spoiler

i thought you had to wait in the secret area and have the monster activate the door to the key in 27, i guess not. Probably need a cyber rocket fired slightly upward, or you need a wallrun bump but I can't seem to wall run on that wall

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gggmork said:

[secret]stuff[/secret] (fuck you secret tags)

Spoiler

it might take a bit of patience, especially the cyber likes to bounce around without triggering the door. 2x iddt for great justice. also it's spoiler, not secret, hehe.

and map16 uv is brutal. even a successful glide doesn't mean easy max.. i was surprised how often the cybers rocket-propelled me straight into the exit, heh.

also i can't finish either of the maps on vanilla doom uv myself. not without intensive save&loading. :)

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dew said:

just hold forward after teleporting. :)


Ah! So wallrunning allows the player to pass through a 32 map units line. I never knew that. So is the term "glide" referring to wallrunning or gliding through a 32 map unit gap ?

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All right dew muthafuckwaaaaa, you may be good at WORD BUBBLES but lets see you figure out THIS map (a little trick I never made until this thread gave me incentive):

map01, boom (probably use prboom+ since I did), only uv implemented, don't watch the uvmax demo till you give up or something:
http://www.speedyshare.com/files/26367734/trick.zip


EDIT: ha ha, I discovered phml's route was possible right after I posted it; probably should have playtested more to see if that tactic was preventable. So uh, yeah, PROTIP: there's a "cooler"/faster/easier way than the obvious way.

Spoiler

those invulns were meant to mislead you, heh

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Here's how I got through it without tricks. Playing the map and seeing

Spoiler

the invul spheres and the teleporting archviles, I thought it had to do with gaining momentum with archviles blasts to get through impassable lines or something... Then I watched your demo, heh. That was insanely cool.

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gggmork said:

(27 skill 4)

oh wow, that was ice cold! here's the boom-based solution. regarding your level..

Spoiler

i lured all the imps out without shooting, then av-jumped into the little alcove, had the cybie kill all unteleported archviles, by that time he went down with just 1 bfg shot.. then i dispatched the rest from the outside.

i can't access the link to phml's solution, but i suspect i exploited the same thing. your solution is eyepopping awesomeness, perhaps we should pack more ideas like these into one wad. :)

hawkwind said:

Ah! So wallrunning allows the player to pass through a 32 map units line. I never knew that.

it's something else. if you want the whole theory, creaphis did a fantastic research on the issue. i'll boil it down: doom engine sucks and approximates a lot of stuff. if you turn, you never face exact geographical directions, because the rough shorttics turning steps are slightly tilted from being aligned to the grid. you are trying to enter a 32-unit gap, but you are not facing it properly even with the best angle, that's why glides are so hard and random. the teleport resets this and aligns you perfectly with the grid, so you glide effortlessly. at least that's how i understand why that thing i did works. :)

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dew said:

the rough shorttics turning steps are slightly tilted from being aligned to the grid

It's not the turning steps, but rather that even when you are facing perfectly (e.g.) north, forward movement doesn't move you in a perfectly northerly direction (due to calculation errors that come into play if you are moving forward with anything more than GF1).

For instance, at the start of STRAIN map07, if you walk or run backwards from the starting position (without turning at all), then you don't exit. Turning clearly doesn't come into this, and it applies whether you have longtics or shorttics. With a stream of GB1 tics, you do make the glide.

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Grazza said:

Turning clearly doesn't come into this, and it applies whether you have longtics or shorttics.

you are right in this, obviously (skill2 map16 of this wad). the teleport does align something just perfectly though, otherwise this wouldn't work so easily.

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I think the reason why the glide is easy in your map16 on skill 2 is that teleporting puts you into a position right next to the wall (precise to the micro-unit), and therefore in perfect position for the glide.

One idea Creaphis put forward when tackling the question "Why do guided glides ever fail?" was that the main problem was getting right next to the wall (it's the position, rather than the angle, that is hard to get exactly right). If you run towards it, you bounce slightly off, and almost any movement towards it will tend to have this effect (at least in a micro-unit sense). This struggle to be tightly against the guide wall is what makes guided glides seem random and awkward. The leftward drift from forward movement is useful in aligning with a wall that is on your left hand side, and this is what makes these guided glides often a little easier than ones with a wall on your right-hand side.

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here's something retarded i made today. you can consider it the largest map ever created, or an utterly pointless proof of concept. doom2 vanilla or prboom+ cl2 only, although it will work with boom too.

just step into the teleporter and don't touch anything for a second or two.

http://www.mediafire.com/?nsyu08chsrb3cyg

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WTF I totally missed this thread cuz it happened while I was MIA for 6 months. Cool to see you mapping, dew.

Also, LOLS, I can now say I've done a void glide. :)

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welp, all the previous links are dead, so i reuploaded whatever i still had lying on my drive. it's not healthy to play though.

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