Doom Ascension Mod: Recruitment & Announcements (Image Heavy)

killer2 said:

May I suggest this music replace map10's?It's really well made.Btw he has done more tracks.You could check it out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU3_QTSeNW0&playnext=1&list=PLEF4D143C3DCFCD6C

You are certainly welcome to add any music you want to your gaming experience. BUT like Dee said, "Were also making a hi-quality soundtrack for the project. Re-recording all the music and sounds in the game."

yes indeed, something along those lines! ** basically were making a totally original total sound replacement for doom that will bear the "Ascension" brand!

Sorry for bump, but... Is this still, um, going on?

yes! And strong.

Very. I've noticed that you are the only non A-Team member who signed up for an ascension forum account but sadly there isn't much activity (or room for activity) in the public forums. Everything interesting happens behind the scenes. There hasn't been a lot of visual progress until recently so the site hasn't had much change lately but that is about to change here in the next few weeks. We will have screenshots of a fully animated monsters in a room with our high resolution wall textures. I will post news of updates in this thread when that happens.

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Oh lawdy, this is amazing. You should hook up with KuriKai and Freelanzer and do the Doom Hi-Res project(s) together: http://forums.yaa.dk/

Most of the textures already have some pretty good hi-resolution counterparts, but the Doom community has REALLY REALLY needed some good models to tie everything together. I would love you forever if you actually do complete these models. Seriously.

Announcement:
OP updated with new screen-shots of Ascension monsters and textures working in-game.

Nomad said:

Oh lawdy, this is amazing. You should hook up with KuriKai and Freelanzer and do the Doom Hi-Res project(s) together: http://forums.yaa.dk/

I somehow missed this post. Sorry for the late reply.

Most of the textures already have some pretty good hi-resolution counterparts, but the Doom community has REALLY REALLY needed some good models to tie everything together. I would love you forever if you actually do complete these models. Seriously.

I had assumed at one time that we were only going to be creating 3d replacements of all the 2d sprites but we have decided that the high-res textures that are available are not in harmony with what we have created.

Have no fear, I only work on the textures during times that i'm taking a break from the 3d assets which would happen whether I was doing high-res textures or not. That means that our work with the high-res textures does not interfere with 3d model work AND they will be released as separate mods. You will be able to chose the dhtp textures rather than the Ascension textures if you so desire.

The monsters and the startan set look fantastic -- this is the first convincing hi-res startan I've seen. I'm not sold on the other textures, though; the hexagon tiles could be a lot better.

esselfortium said:

... the hexagon tiles could be a lot better.

I think the main problem with that flat as it is right now is that it is not nearly as dark as the vanilla version. The flats & textures are definitely a work in progress. That being said, there will be vast amount of Ascension exclusive textures and flats available for download and some people may find them more exciting and usable than our vanilla "remakes".

Edit: I just realized that I have used the wall version of that texture as the flat. The actual flat has not been created yet.

Personally, I wish Dday supported flat/texture randomization in the same way it does with model skins; i.e. it will pick one of say 6 variants for each tile. The high-res flats really highlight the tiling.

Vermil said:

Personally, I wish Dday supported flat/texture randomization in the same way it does with model skins; i.e. it will pick one of say 6 variants for each tile. The high-res flats really highlight the tiling.

Ooh, yeah, that would be a nice feature. Although I think that the horrid tiling you get in games with tiles this small is one of the more forgivable limitations. Personally I would rather have the ability to create tiles much larger so that a 2048x2048 texture could fill in where 16 tiles of 512x512 would normally be (I still have not researched whether this is possible through Doomsday Engine).

NiuHaka said:

Ooh, yeah, that would be a nice feature. Although I think that the horrid tiling you get in games with tiles this small is one of the more forgivable limitations. Personally I would rather have the ability to create tiles much larger so that a 2048x2048 texture could fill in where 16 tiles of 512x512 would normally be (I still have not researched whether this is possible through Doomsday Engine).

It is possible in the latest betas; one can use the wip material definition system to change the sizes of the original flats and textures to any size you want (and of course make all new textures and flats of any size you want). However there are currently a couple of issues with flats larger than 64x64.

Heres a texture example that makes the original texture BROWN144 512x512 instead of 128x128. For a flat, replace the namespace with "flats".

Material {
ID = "BROWN144";
Namespace = textures;
Width = 512.0;
Height = 512.0;
}

Vermil said:

It is possible in the latest betas; one can use a material def to change the sizes of the original flats and textures to any size you want (and of course make all new textures and flats of any size you want). However there are currently a couple of issues with flats larger than 64x64 currently.

Heres a texture example that makes the original texture BROWN144 256x256 instead of 128x128. For a flat, replace the namespace with "flats".

Material {
ID = "BROWN144";
Namespace = textures;
Width = 256.0;
Height = 256.0;
}

Wow man... I'm beginning to think I need to try to recruit you. Would there happen to be a list of the bugs for implementing this in the Doomsday forums or wiki? This could really make things prettier and that's what I'm all about.

NiuHaka said:

Wow man... I'm beginning to think I need to try to recruit you. Would there happen to be a list of the bugs for implementing this in the Doomsday forums or wiki? This could really make things prettier and that's what I'm all about.

Check your PM's :)

esselfortium said:

... the hexagon tiles could be a lot better.

I don't think that this is any kind of real improvement but it is more accurate. Yesterday I realized that we were using the wall version of that texture and that we didn't actually have the floor version so I quickly threw together a version that was more accurate. But like I said, I doubt it will get an actual improvement. There are a lot of textures to get to.

That's definitely an improvement. I think the main problem remaining is that there's a pattern of streaks going downwards in one direction, as would be if it were on a wall rather than on the floor.

Does Doomsday (or any ports for that matter) support normal/bump/specular maps? If so, that should definitely be taken advantage of in this project.

Doom Legacy 2 was showing shots of using that but that's been in development hell for about 4 years or so.

As for the textures. While these textures are working well at a distance as seen in the right most part of the above shot. It doesn't really work in close range simply because the textures don't make sense. Just looks weird and unnatural. Just like Doom is a low res game, so is the textuers. The art of Doom was made for the resolution. Or rather, with it in mind.

Sodaholic said:

Does Doomsday (or any ports for that matter) support normal/bump/specular maps? If so, that should definitely be taken advantage of in this project.

Doomsday does not currently support normal maps. Even if it did we would not use normal maps because it just adds quite a bit more work. Plus our textures already have a light source baked into them which would clash against the light sources you would need to utilize normal maps. If you have ever seen the textures that are used in conjunction with normal maps you would notice that they are very nondescript with everything other than the actual surface texture. Just look at Doom 3s textures and you will see what I'm talking about.

kristus said:

As for the textures. While these textures are working well at a distance as seen in the right most part of the above shot. It doesn't really work in close range simply because the textures don't make sense. Just looks weird and unnatural. Just like Doom is a low res game, so is the textuers. The art of Doom was made for the resolution. Or rather, with it in mind.

Well, yeah, I agree with that 90% (only 90 because i'm not quite sure what about these textures is supposed to make sense. You probably mean that they don't make sense with respect to the default resolutions and if that is the case I agree 100%). These textures are being made with higher resolutions monitors in mind. Also, the models just need the higher res textures in order to have some kind of harmony. You can see what I mean by looking at the examples here. The second screenshot down shows a copse on a high res flat while the third one down shows a gibed corpse on a default low res flat. The low res texture gives it a floating effect because the two just don't mesh.

This project will definitely not appeal to a great many established Doomers. Doom purists will not have any love for these mods. I have always been aware that these mods are somewhat of a novelty. Not that any of that really matters to me because I am the only person I'm doing this for which is also why I have not changed anything due to any received C.C. I'm one of those artists. It is the beauty of not doing this for work.

I'm looking forward to seeing what the pinky will look like. Hopefully something at that's at least somewhat unnerving.

I think Kristus means that the shapes on some of the original textures defy logic, but it is masked by their low resolution.

Personally, from the examples you've shown, your hi-res textures are consistent, but they don't feature much if any new details over the original textures. For instance on your STARG1 hi-res texture, the only added detail I can see over the original is the bolt indent's on the corners. Though I think that is an issue with most hi-res textures made for Doom, not just yours.

I'd also comment that the textures appear to be a lot more faithful to the originals than the models. Might be a bit of clash there.

But note, I don't mean that the textures are faithful because they don't add any notable details over the original; one can have hi-res textures that feature loads of extra details but are still faithful to the originals.

Vermil said:

I think Kristus means that the shapes on some of the original textures defy logic, but it is masked by tbeir low resolution.

Personally, from the examples you've shown, your hi-res textures are consistent, but they don't feature any new details over the original textures.

For instance on your STARG1 hi-res texture, the only added detail I can see over the original is the bolt indent's on the corners.

Ok that makes sense. Yes any high-res "remakes" will retain their main features. I think the good stuff is happening with our Ascension exclusive textures but I won't be showcasing any of that yet.

You know, I've been thinking...wouldn't it be better if you first remade all the assets in E1M1 for a small demo?This way we can actually feel how the whole thing is coming together!Of course you decide whether you do this or not.

DooM_RO said:

You know, I've been thinking...wouldn't it be better if you first remade all the assets in E1M1 for a small demo?This way we can actually feel how the whole thing is coming together!Of course you decide whether you do this or not.

This won't happen. Mostly because a "demo" would take longer than what i've got planned anyway. Once all Doom 1 monsters are completed they will be released as a single mod. Once the Doom 2 monsters are completed that will be a second mod. Weapons, items, decorative objects, textures, g.u.i., etc. will all get their own mods. Once all mods are completed there will be a final and complete mod which combines all mods together to change all visuals in the game.

Another reason this won't happen is that demos are generally used to hype a product in order to sell it. I'm not doing this to be popular or to be the one who made a popular mod. I'm doing this because I love the Ascension project and I love Doom. I'm not concerned with convincing anyone who is on the fence that they should love this because it doesn't effect me whether this thing gets a thousand downloads or one download. What I am concerned about is how fun the project is and how good looking I think it is.

I just want to say that I take back the comments I made about the imp model a few months ago about it not being 'evil looking' enough.

Now that I've seen screenies of it in the actual game it looks pretty damn evil. Keep up the good work!

Marnetmar said:

I just want to say that I take back the comments I made about the imp model a few months ago about it not being 'evil looking' enough.

Now that I've seen screenies of it in the actual game it looks pretty damn evil. Keep up the good work!

Yeah, I think seeing him outside of his t-pose and in an actual walking pose really adds a lot to the look. That and I might have changed the texture a little due to your comment... I can't remember though.

These new photos of the original models might help with making the Revenant, Mancubus, Spiderdemon and Arch-Vile more accurate when you get to them.

TrueDude said:

[url=http://www.doomworld.com/vb/doomworld-news/56435-a-voyage-into-id/These new photos of the original models[/url] might help with making the Revenant, Mancubus, Spiderdemon and Arch-Vile more accurate when you get to them.

Thanks for the link TrueDude. I missed that one. There are some differences between those models and the final version of the sprites and I'd rather stay truer to the sprites. However, being only slightly true to the sprites is much more interesting to me than just replicating the sprites into models. I am making some creative liberties to a few of the monsters that might be slightly controversial among the Doom community but they are changes that I feel are justified. So, yeah, accuracy is a small concern of mine but thanks for the link. Those photos were fun to look at.

How many textures has the DA team created? It seems like a huge job. I was going to suggest asking the author if you could use the Jdoom hi-res texture pack. But then I thought, you could just get more artists to contribute to the texture making.