Okay, so we have Brutal Doom, but is there any similar mod for Heretic or something? Or would that idea be the grounds for a new project?

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If somebody starts to make a Brutal Heretic mod, I would try it.

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Mithran Denizen said:

I can't really envision Heretic being 'brutal'.


Haha, same. As violent as Heretic actually is, I've never actually pictured it as a violent game. The enemies are too mystical and the weapons are too magical and everything is too colorful. There's just something so innocent about it.

Hexen, on the other hand, is much darker than Heretic and the weapons are more personal.. so I'd flag it as a much more 'brutal-worthy' game.

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Mithran Denizen said:

I can't really envision Heretic being 'brutal'.

I can. Then again it already is brutal and atmospheric.

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Brutal Strife might work.
Brutal HeXen would be a coding nightmare.
Brutal Chex Quest would not work at all.
Brutal Virus would be pointless.
Brutal HacX needs to be a thing.
Brutal Harmony would make the game better.
Brutal Heretic......I just can't see happening.

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Robomorons said:

Brutal Strife might work.
Brutal HeXen would be a coding nightmare.
Brutal Chex Quest would not work at all.
Brutal Virus would be pointless.
Brutal HacX needs to be a thing.
Brutal Harmony would make the game better.
Brutal Heretic......I just can't see happening.


1.Agree.
2.But look, there are many people who have much experiences about DECORATE and ACS. Possible.
3.Pointless.
4.Not pointless at all. New crash effects for machines and programes, etc.
5. Yes, that's absolutely needed.
6. Agree.
7. I think, for example the death of D'Sparil might be more epic than the original animation.

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I don't know if I can see Heretic being brutal, as others have said, but if it was made, I would play it.

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DeathevokatioN said:

I can. Then again it already is brutal and atmospheric.

QFT

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Heretic can't be brutal? Then what about all those always gibbing corpses in the original game?

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Here's my thought: Brutal Doom works because it adds a huge thrill to the sheer destruction one can cause with a well placed shot. It's because of the guns working the way they do, and how the blood effects work, that Brutal Doom succeeds at what it does.

Heretic, on the other hand, has no guns. Outside of the Phoenix Rod, it barely has any weapons that seem like they'd cause huge damage like a shotgun to the face. Sure, it'd make you bleed, but these are magical weapons, somehow I can't imagine them doing much more than acting like telekinetic punches. I guess I never was much a fan of fantasy/magical weaponry.

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I think Dragon Claw, Phoenix Rod and the basic Wand might cause flamming or flamed corpse parts. Also, Hellstaff might do overdamage (like shotgun in the face) which causes that the "subject" flames very quickly and its bones are remained for a short time in the air (like when the Heresiarch dies)

Or maybe brand new appearance to the weapons then you use Tome of Power: more and nicer electric bolts on your hands, flashing wand, sparkling dragon claw, Doom beast skull appears on Hellstaff, etc.

These are my ideas.

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As already said, Heretic is too magic and colorfull for it. To make this work, many aspects in Heretic should change. For example, Korvus should be some kind of a Battlemage, and there should have some steel weapons here. The melee weapon should be an axe, the Crossbow still could be magically powered, but should fire iron bolts (I wounder how does ethereal magic could deal damage), and instead Dragon Claw, maybe a Magic-powered automatic Nailgun?

I could start it someday after I get further in BrĂ¼tal Doom's progress, but not right now.

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Well the idea looked better on paper... But a bloodier Heretic would be cool...

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I'm not saying that I would use a brutal heretic mod. But just to all you people who think Heretic isn't brutal already for some arbitrary and preconceptive reason. You are all ginormous twats.

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Imagination plays more of a role in wheter one finds Heretic "brutal" or not, simply because there is little "real world" to relate it to, like Doom.

We know what a shotgun pellet does if it hit's flesh, but what do you envisage the Disciple's missiles doing if they hit flesh (i.e draining, burning, shreading etc..)?

Countless things tell us what Hell is like and that plays into our imagination when we play Doom. But what goes on in the Dome of D'sparil hasn't been pre-planted in our heads by other things.

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Vermil said:

but what do you envisage the Disciple's missiles doing if they hit flesh (i.e draining, burning, shreading etc..)?

Consider an equivalent from another game, such as Warcraft (2). If you ask me, I'd say that the necromantic spells from that game are quite creepy and gory (death and decay, death coil and so on). Same thing could be considered about Disciples' projectiles, if you want, not to mention that they look the same as Gul'dan's (Warcraft 2) death knights.

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There was this "Wrath of Magic" Mod for Heretic played with Doomsday Engine, it changes the whole graphics of the game and makes it more brutal, gloomy, dark, whatever, but on the other hand more trashy because the graphics differ in terms of quality. I began working on a ZDoom version for this also with the aim to let it look less trashy... I'll probably also load it up one day.

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kristus said:

I'm not saying that I would use a brutal heretic mod. But just to all you people who think Heretic isn't brutal already for some arbitrary and preconceptive reason. You are all ginormous twats.

Yeah, this whole "it's colorful and magical therefore it's not brutal" stuff is silly.

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Brutal Heretic MIGHT work, but it would require a lot of trial and error... If you're thinking of doing it, go ahead, but if it takes more than about a year or so to fix bugs and bring it up to speed to what you imagine, as well as release a beta or alpha, drop it... I think that Brutal Strife, HeXen, Wolfenstein, etc. should all exist. They just deserve it.

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Heretic, not being brutal? have you ever played any of the custom PWADs for it? ROP and Curse of D'Sparil are fricking hard.

not to mention, the monster deaths are waaaaaay gorier than Dooms. like, default animation for most of the monster deaths results in them EXPLODING into gibs. yes, barons guts bust out and mancubi deaths are pretty gory, but they just explode into deadness. those magic weapons have to be really powerful to cause such a spontaneous combustion of gore.

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An old incomplete Version of Brutal Hexen does exist and it's pretty fun. However the ultimate weapon is bugged, the glory kills are very limited to a couple and you can only play as the warrior. I also had an incomplete issue at the final Boss, a monster was stuck inside a room.

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supernintendont said:

Brutal Heretic MIGHT work, but it would require a lot of trial and error... If you're thinking of doing it, go ahead, but if it takes more than about a year or so to fix bugs and bring it up to speed to what you imagine, drop it... I think that Brutal Strife, HeXen, Wolfenstein, etc. should all exist. They just deserve it.

That bizarre necro though.

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I'd flat out love to see a brutal heretic. Anything can be made more brutal and I fail to see the innocence of heretic's look. As previously stated monster deaths are more gory and I could see some cool kills/executions going on with the standard weapons. Never mind when you hit that ToP and the weapons go crazy.

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vadrig4r said:

That bizarre necro though.

Rezing old threads should require you to confirm a dialog asking if you're REALLY sure you want to do this, for as many times as there are years in the bump. Adding one more "really" every time.

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