This has turned into the official "Help SavageCorona learn to map really good".

SavageCorona said:

Bump:
I made something actually worthwhile. It's WIP and only has one level but it's sort of ok I guess.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4qvhuzksx64pz8b/some%20cave%20thing%20idk.wad

I like that style of "use your automap" and the "run run run" style in this map.
And there's almost no detail in this map you could put some liquids in the caves(ex. lava, water, mud, blood stains) and add some lights.
BTW, those lite textures by the sides of the start door looks awful.

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joe-ilya said:

I like that style of "use your automap" and the "run run run" style in this map.
And there's almost no detail in this map you could put some liquids in the caves(ex. lava, water, mud, blood stains) and add some lights.
BTW, those lite textures by the sides of the start door looks awful.


I don't think lava pools are "detailing" rather "adding lava pools" and where was I supposed to put lights in a cave?

Also there were no LITE3 or LITE5 textures around the start door, there was no border around the door at all. The level sort of progresses as I progressed in skill, hence why it looks better near the end than the start.

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The floor lamps don't actually create light unless you set your OpenGL settings to do so.

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SavageCorona said:

I don't think lava pools are "detailing" rather "adding lava pools" and where was I supposed to put lights in a cave?


They do, though.

As for lights in a cave, get creative; lava pools are a source of light (because the way lava works, although realistically it doesn't give off as much light as you'd imagine), or what about small niches to put torches/lamps in. A small table (possibly left by miners, who would rest between mining -- as an example?) perhaps?

The key is with making details in maps, to get creative.

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SavageCorona said:

The floor lamps don't actually create light unless you set your OpenGL settings to do so.


Oh don't be so lazy for fuck's sake.

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BaronOfStuff said:

Oh don't be so lazy for fuck's sake.


This. Sector based lighting may not be as realistic, but there's no reason not to use it.

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Your map is very flat and boring. Try to employ more height variation and think of ways to use monsters to their strength. Try to use colour and lighting contrast to draw the players attention to certain areas.

I did 10 minutes of work in your cave to show an example;

before

after

Keep at it and you'll find yourself with a very rewarding hobby. :)

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Thanks for the encouragement, Khorus. However, I'm not really a big fan of that white ceiling, it looks a little garish next to the browns, but I will work on improving the area, seeing as that's the only big problem with it that people have noticed.

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SavageCorona said:

However, I'm not really a big fan of that white ceiling, it looks a little garish next to the browns


The point is that what was there before was rather plain, with the after having objects of interest. It takes a lot of time and practice, so the important thing is to keep producing and challenging yourself.

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joe-ilya said:


Well, first off, I didn't "detail". That's a phrase that gets thrown about all the time, but means about as much as a mini-skirt to a pygmy. I attempted to shed light on some of the fundamental problems in the level design, such as a lack of height variation, colour contrast, fights that had some interest as opposed to barons in a huge, empty cavern and so forth. Be more specific in your criticisms than "detail".

Secondly, you've done nothing to improve the areas. I don't get what's going on in that first shot (fireblu1 texture representing water heh), and the second has been given clutter to look more busy. Think architecture, shapes and space. Then you'll find that not only the maps have more character and appeal, but that gameplay options will open up, too.

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joe-ilya said:


All you did was add in some stuff to make it seem like stuff was going on, when really it wasn't and it made it uglier than it was before. The point was it was an empty area to lure the player into thinking the place is deserted until he opens the door and finds a demon in his face, and cue action.

I fixed up the caves with some stuff to make it more interesting to look at and fight in. The second one hasn't had much to change combat tactics other than the Barons/Hell knights are now in 2 small ledges in an opening on either side rather than just being flat. I also added in a small element of non-linearity of how you kill the Mancubi, either just kill them with the shotgun/chaingun, run for the plasma gun and hope to not die or try to find the secret rocket launcher and (partially) kill them with that.

The link should've updated itself but I'll repost it just in case it didn't.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4qvhuzksx64pz8b/some%20cave%20thing%20idk.wad

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