The DWmegawad Club plays: Alien Vendetta

MAP04: Seclusion

This map feels rompy to me with the generous health, plentiful low-tier enemies and sometimes jokey traps, especially the series leading to the computer map. I did a pistol start, and ammo got tight around the imp swarm triggered by the switch behind the red door. Overall, this is fun, and it makes me think about how small the differences can be between classic megawads and other, lost-to-time sets that were a tad too unremarkable to warrant a community replay 14 years later.

dobu gabu maru said:

So did you guys just pool all the maps together at the end and then refine them? Or was Johnsen the leader and choosing which to keep and which to trash as you guys submitted maps? How did the re-release come about (whose idea was it)? And what was the playtesting like, if you don't mind me asking?

The refinement happened in periodic waves, as we'd look back at older "finished" maps after acquiring more personal skill with the process. The final wave was probably ~3-4 months prior to release and was the most aggressive and far reaching, and yeah maps were always being cut here and there for various reasons. Johnsen was the sole dictator but that's what kept the project moving - if it was a democracy with everyone trying to put their stamp on decisions then it'd take 20 years to finish. I'm sure he took input from other people but generally you just go with the plan he laid out. edit: although I did fight him over cutting Valley of Echoes, and eventually got the last laugh there ;-)

The re-release was more of a compet-n thing, if I recall? I was spending time on other projects at that point so can't really comment.

Playtesting was exhaustive. There were many folks submitting demos, screenshots, and reports for every beta version of a map. One map could easily go through 10-20 revisions, with 5-10 testers providing input for each version. There was some serious dedication there and the testers don't get enough credit for their involvement with the project. Mappers would also test and provide input on eachothers' maps, but only a handful were active in this capacity.

Map 04 - Seclusion: 98% kills, 50% secrets

Having arrived at the end of the tracks leading out of the cargo depot, the player now assaults an incredibly generic and linear techbase. While the visuals and layout are nothing to write home about, this map is the first in the set to exhibit a kind of proto-slaughtermap gameplay, with several encounters where progression lies beyond a horde of monsters. One important component that's missing though is a way to force the player to deal with the horde on its terms. Every fight can be easily backed out of or kited and there's always enough ammo to deal with every enemy without having to work your way past them for more.

There were a few things about this map that baffled or outright annoyed me. The cave with the SSG in the beginning is marked as a secret despite being glaringly obvious. The chaingunners at the dock can be pushed off their perches and become unkillable (the reason for my 98% kills). Same with the archvile before the yellow key door.

Ultimately, this was a very forgettable level. At least if I remember correctly the next one is really good.

Solarn, live monsters can't be pushed off ledges in the correct compatibility setting: that is -complevel 2 in prBoom+, and Doom (I forget the exact name) in (G)ZDoom.

Map05
The single, easy to find secret on this map seems excessively generous to me, but that’s about the only significant complaint I can muster for this level.

The map presents us with a moody BSTONE and METAL fortress in the middle of a lake of toxic blood. It’s quite a sharp thematic shift from the run of more technologically themed maps immediately before it - I get the feeling that AV probably didn’t have any official guidelines about look and feel - but it looks pretty great so I’m more than willing to let it slide.

Gameplay is also pretty strong. I think it was a mistake to put block monster lines on the entrance of the rocket launcher room, but the map otherwise delivers. In particular there’s the fight at the top of the northern lift, which feels a lot more hectic than the monster count would suggest. The map also does a much better job of letting you explore than the last two maps. While you ultimately have to collect the three keys in a specific order, most of the rest of the map is open to you from the very start. I appreciate this more free-flowing design.

MAP04 - Seclusion (MAX'D)

Now we're really starting to step things up, in all aspects of the phrase. Monster counts are higher, difficulty is more devious, with a ton of ridiculous monster closets stuffed into the cramped corridors, which makes for fun times (and for me to utilize saves for the first time in this playthrough). We're also getting away from the brown brick aesthetic from the first 3 levels in favor of a more standard techbase-styled level, which works well for keeping things from getting monotonous. Outside of those, and the nice continuity callback at the start, there's not much more to say here. Just a fun, solid level, with a tendency to kill you with dick traps.

rdwpa said:

Solarn, live monsters can't be pushed off ledges in the correct compatibility setting: that is -complevel 2 in prBoom+, and Doom (I forget the exact name) in (G)ZDoom.

'Doom (Strict)' ?

04 - Seclusion

This one marks a slight step up in difficulty (and monster count--248 on HMP). The first trap is potentially pretty nasty, but I remembered it from my UV attempt a few months ago, so I was quick to retreat to safety. I love the sense of continuity these maps create by linking the start to the previous map's exit, as with the rails here. The exterior locations look great, with the cave at the start and the second outside area, both of which make use of verticality--imps in the cave, revs outside the yellow door. I thought the interior detailing was fantastic, though that's quickly becoming a given in AV. I don't have much to say about the gameplay, because it's very simple and well-executed. In terms of map flow, it has the tried-and-true feel of the IWADs. Maybe I'm thinking of the gating in particular, and how the map uses the keys to split the map into distinct segments, each with their own flavor.

The map does a very good job creating, and taking advantage of, the illusion of verticality. I wish I had more to say about this one, because it was my favorite map up until 06.

05 - Crimson Tide

This is the first map in the set for which I didn't jot down any comments as I played. The gameplay is solid, no complaints there, but the...building did feel kind of empty on account of the open layout combined with the modest (on HMP) monster count. 05 dispenses with the representationalism; I would guess it's a hellish church of some sort but it does feel like the most abstract map so far (I'm gonna go out on a limb and say this isn't the same author as those of 02-04). Visually, though, it's fantastic, particularly the interiors. It's not as tough as 04, but this is one I'd definitely like to replay on UV, which probably makes for an entirely different and less leisurely experience. I did appreciate the revs that showed up. Fun map.

Can't wait to talk about 06. I think I took about as many notes on it as I did for the entire set up to this point.

rdwpa said:

Solarn, live monsters can't be pushed off ledges in the correct compatibility setting: that is -complevel 2 in prBoom+, and Doom (I forget the exact name) in (G)ZDoom.

And now a lot of small things make sense. I accidentally played the map in the default compatibility instead of -complevel 2.

Map 07 actually breaks if you're in default prBoom complevel (or cl 9), so be sure you get it right before that map.

Cynical said:

Map 07 actually breaks if you're in default prBoom complevel (or cl 9), so be sure you get it right before that map.

Or be prepared to IDCLIP :)

Ma05: the difficulty starts to raise here. There aren't many monsters actually but they are used well in the small encounters this map offers. The theme and the style feels like a reprise of The Inmost Dens, and for what I remember here we depart from the tech-baase theme, for some levels at least.

Some catching up to do...

Map 02 - Rusty Rage

A short, punchy tech-base level that reminds me in general of Ultimate Doom episode one. The texture scheme is certainly quite different and the combat a good deal nastier, but its use of windows as viewpoints into later parts of the level to visit - not to mention that you can get some nasty crossfire through them (IE the window showing the yellow key and how you can get the Imps and chaingunners to infight with it) gives me a similar vibe. While still an easy map, it certainly has its fair share of nasty traps to first-timers, EG the Arch-vile ambush when collecting the yellow key. Quick, punchy and very fun.

Here is a -solonet UV-max of map04. Would've been irritated to lose this near the end to . . . that. Also thanks rehelekretep for the soundfont.

Map 05: Crimson Tide

This map's fine but doesn't leave much to write about as few things really stand out. The visual style is something I've seen before several times, particularly in Scythe map15 and Resurgence map23. A rather quick and easy map.

Vorpal said:

The refinement happened in periodic waves, as we'd look back at older "finished" maps after acquiring more personal skill with the process. The final wave was probably ~3-4 months prior to release and was the most aggressive and far reaching, and yeah maps were always being cut here and there for various reasons. Johnsen was the sole dictator but that's what kept the project moving - if it was a democracy with everyone trying to put their stamp on decisions then it'd take 20 years to finish. I'm sure he took input from other people but generally you just go with the plan he laid out. edit: although I did fight him over cutting Valley of Echoes, and eventually got the last laugh there ;-)

The re-release was more of a compet-n thing, if I recall? I was spending time on other projects at that point so can't really comment.

Playtesting was exhaustive. There were many folks submitting demos, screenshots, and reports for every beta version of a map. One map could easily go through 10-20 revisions, with 5-10 testers providing input for each version. There was some serious dedication there and the testers don't get enough credit for their involvement with the project. Mappers would also test and provide input on eachothers' maps, but only a handful were active in this capacity.

Thanks again for answering my questions—crazy how much you guys refined a single mapset, and it makes me wonder if other megawads prior had gone through such a rigorous testing phase.

MAP04: Really love this midi—still gotta find some map to apply it to. Anyway, I feel this level fares better than the previous one, mainly because it’s a bit toothier. The blocky enemy placement is really reminiscent of Hell Revealed, but Berggren isn’t keen on making the player a glutton for punishment, offering them a suitable supply of ammo to chew through the hordes with. Best part of the map was definitely that multi-layered trap—gotta admit, that got me real good, even with the invisibility on. This map’s linear nature really isn’t doing anything to tickle my fancy, but I’ve yet to play a level in this megawad that’s struck me as completely pointless, so I’m still feeling some good vibes coming out of this.

MAP05: Man, this is an excellent way to make a short level. It’s thematically strong (though cribbing slightly from The Inmost Dens), it has an appropriate amount of resistance, some good progression, and nice visuals. There’s even consistency in that GARG faces activate lifts! Sure, the monster placement itself is a mite underutilized—that AV loses all of his bluster when you spot him and the PEs are straight-up SSG fodder, but the map shows how dangerous revs and chaingunners can be even when placed in straight hallways.

It looks like I completely forgot to add my thoughts here. Anyways, I'm doing this in video format.

Playlist here.

Map 01: Really interesting map. Enjoyed the short design.

Map 02: No complaints here, feels like a tech base but a bit out of place. Map 2 feels like it connects with Map 3 better than Map 1 connects with Map 2. Map 1 feels like it should connect with Map 5 than Map 2, but that's just me.

(Video for Map 1 and 2.)

Videos for Map 3, and Map 4 are being uploaded at the moment. Will post once they're available, or keep an eye on that playlist.

06: I loved this one layout and texturing. I liked how you access the initial area again but without the walls, creating a new battlefieds and having a new area to explore. I still didn't like how this wad deals with nukage: sometimes it damages you, but sometimes doesn't. I wish it was more consistent about this.

The monsters compositions was kinda so-so: The initial area was well done: Caco's flying at you, low ranked monsters waiting for you to give the signal and Mancubus at the top sniping you. Some others battlefields allows lots of in-fighting too. Still, I wish there was a lot less Hell Knights and Baron of Hells. They didn't add much to the gameplay and made things drag more than it should, especial at the RK door fight, IMO. Also, a cyberdemon this early means scaling is going to be fast, I guess later we will have some slaughtermaps. 7/10

Even if you are in Kiribati (and I very much doubt you are), there are still at least 6 hours until it is the 6th.

MAP03: Cargo Depot
14:54 | 100% Everything

As others have said, this a nice-looking map, some good representational bits. I especially liked the little underground waterfall cave; very cool. The Heretic crates were a little weird; I kept thinking the symbols might be triggers for a secret, but no dice.


MAP04: Seclusion
17:46 | 100% Everything

Love this map. This is actually the first place I died thus far, and I did so twice: once in the initial layer of the (awesomely-multilayered) teleport/closet ambush near the red key doors. The second time was after grabbing the red key, to the pop-up chaingunners. But I still love this level; it's just so punchy, with constant combat, often with hilariously-large groups of baddies. So much fun.


MAP05: Crimson Tide
14:21 | 100% Everything

Another of what I consider a "classic" level (usually meaning its early enough in the WAD that I've played it more frequently; these first half-dozen of so maps are what pop into my mind first when I think "Alien Vendetta".) This one's got a much lower monster count than the previous level, but maybe a bit more bite due to the revenants and chaingunners. (Then again, I didn't die on this one, so what do I know?) I guess this one just felt more dangerous. Love that Hexen portal at the end.

map05

As I play these maps, I'm just overwhelmed by the strains of influence. I think, Oh, so that is where this trope was popularized, or even where it was born. The surface aesthetic is indeed very Inmost Dens, but the clean shapes and the symmetrical inset schemes make me think of Alm and the countless mappers who would take after him. The terraced architecture would go on to become a staple of many schools of design, particularly the compact and polished mid-2000s style, you know, Tormentor's Detail Guide. :D

Despite the simplicity of the layout, moving through this fortress felt like an exploration, because the fastest route isn't highlighted with a trail of flashing lights. There are detours, and dead ends, and even a lift that calls on you to think a little. A berserk pack and plenty of surplus ammo is hidden out of sight in boling blood, a reward for the curious, or perhaps the clumsy. The plasma rifle is refreshingly free; many maps of this sort present it as the flagship 'optional goodie', a trope descending from the original games, but a stale one all the same. Decent map.

AV. One of my all time fav megawads. If not THE fav.

map01: Always liked this one. Not the best gameplay, but I love the theme which goes sooo well with the orange sky. Really sets the mood. map01 in AV...simply ultra-nostalgia.

map02: Somewhat generic techbase map with a few not-that-interesting outside areas. I really like the gameplay in this one though. MAYBE one of the bottom three maps in AV for me.

map03: This map does not look nice, feels totally out of place in AV imo, and plays like shit. Tied for worst map in AV together with another map later in the WAD.

map04: Simple and old school looking, linear base map with simple spammy gameplay with loads of resources and uptempo melodic music. Sounds like something I´d hate, but for some reason I actually really dig this map! TBH its one of the maps I´ve played the most in AV haha.

map05: Strong thematic style, and nice visuals in general. I dig. This map (and others like it (Alm, Inmost..., Plutonia etc) has inspired my own style alot.

map06: I have to admit Im not a fan of how this map looks, but I think it plays good...at least for speedrunning. It looks like someone tried to immitate Erik Alm´s style, but didnt have as good sense of visuals as him. Kinda. Cool stuff nevertheless.

I think, if I continue writing up some of my thoughts on the maps in AV, you´ll notice I´m sounding not-that-impressed by many of the maps, but AV still stands as one of my favs anyway :)

Capellan said:

Even if you are in Kiribati (and I very much doubt you are), there are still at least 6 hours until it is the 6th.

I thought that my timezone is the fastest among the DWMC participants, with UTC +9:00 timeline.

When I posted my review for map 06, it was already 1am here

Deadwing said:

When I posted my review for map 06, it was already 1am here

I'm at GMT +10, and it still isn't the 6th here. For It to be 1am on the 6th when you posted, you'd have to be at GMT +22. There's no such place. Maybe you're just misreading the date?

darkreaver said:

It looks like someone tried to immitate Erik Alm´s style, but didnt have as good sense of visuals as him

Achieving this two years before Scythe is worth some points surely :)
As a big fan of Erik's work I'm taking this as a compliment, however it's still the 5th here so I'll leave Siege till tomorrow.

MAP04: Seclusion

This map feels quite similar to MAP03: very nice and atmospheric visuals (all these windows out into the orange sky really give the feeling of a refreshing breeze coming in through them; the mellow music certainly helps in setting the tone), but the gameplay consists mainly of mowing down the hordes of monsters right in front of you. None of it is threatening at all, with the glaring exception of the infamous huge trap where you really need that blursphere, a blue armor, full health and an idea of where to go in order to survive. But after that, things mellow down once more. Even the second key trap is palpably underwhelming compared to the sudden chaingunner pop-up around the first key. The ending with the teleporting monster wave is a joke, as you get lots of ammo and plenty of room, so you can just stand by the door and leisurely blast every monster that sluggishly approaches.

I guess this is sort of a transition map; after the rather easy challenges of the previous levels, the big trap is a wake-up call that things might be getting increasingly tricky from here on.

One convention which caught my eye on the maps so far is the practice of making a big, spread-out clump of health bonuses, as opposed to some of today's maps which prefer to put all the health bonuses exactly on top of each other. Both approaches certainly have their strengths and shortcomings (the big clumps look pretty ugly and amateurish.)

MAP05: Crimson Tide

This is another map I remember easily mainly due to that upstairs gothic area with the red door; but in today's playthrough, the most atmospheric part was probably sneaking your way around the outer wall, bursting into the guard towers and gunning down the sentries looking over the horizon. If you run carelessly it's rather easy to misstep and end up falling into the red acid, but thankfully it just adds a new dimension of challenge instead of being frustrating.

MAP05 Crimson Tide

It's short and it works like Inmost Dens, but I always beat it rather quickly, so I don't actually find it memorable. With that said, the plasma gun area, with the switch in the hell knight pen, is a highlight if for the monsters that teleport once you try to reach the platform that leads to the blue key. I hate how you need to "grab" the other two keys though, for some reason I have to ram them in order to get both. The blood sea isn't all that much to note, but there is only one radiation suit (just under the exit), as well as a berserk hidden in a rather clever spot in the blood.

Hmm I don't remember having any problems the last time I played MAP07 in ZDoom.

Capellan said:

I'm at GMT +10, and it still isn't the 6th here. For It to be 1am on the 6th when you posted, you'd have to be at GMT +22. There's no such place. Maybe you're just misreading the date?

You're right, I'm messing up the dates again lol Today is 5, not 6. Sorry about that, again.

Szymanski said:

Achieving this two years before Scythe is worth some points surely :)
As a big fan of Erik's work I'm taking this as a compliment, however it's still the 5th here so I'll leave Siege till tomorrow.

Hehe =) The architecture of the map is surely ahead of its time. I just find the texturing a little bland and forgettable. I just went through the map again, and I really can't put my finger on anything specific, heh...I guess its just one of those things you like/dont like but you can't exactly explain why.

So I guess Alm looked at this map and went on and did it "better" (in my eyes) ;P

Also its not the 6th here, I was a bit fast on the trigger there.