Albertoni

The very, very classic Void: https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/levels/doom2/Ports/v-z/void

You probably already played it, but in case you didn't...

As it stands right now, yeah, it won't fit.
The infinite staircase was definitely interesting, the part where you shoot over voodoo dolls was creative, and the red key section had some nice ideas (but I got bored of dying 10 times just to find out there was more and more platforming so I ended up cheating and flying through it >_>)

As for the teleport maze, it wasn't a fun idea back when TNT was released. It's still not a fun idea. If you want to see a teleport maze done right (which means it's only annoying instead of infuriating) you should look for a recent release named Absolutely Killed, map E1M3 has the best teleport maze I've played recently.

Oh, in that puzzle where you need to press 4 buttons in the right order so the marines won't be crushed, how does that secret in the wall relate to the buttons? I thought that was a cool idea, but even with that secret guide it was a trial and error affair.

Thanks, guys. My map is pretty much done, if you want to see it in action I've updated the file. Now all that remains is to wait for the beta phase so I can get more feedback on it.

AD_79 said:

The grass, I'm not so sure about, seems a little too excessive, heh.

Well, it's kinda supposed to be the overrun by nature side of the map. The other parts are much less dense. I'm just afraid someone with a toaster for a computer might get some framerate issues.

Hmm, yeah, I can definitely get a feeling for what you mean.
I'm not quite sure how to actually translate it to Doom terms, at least not with the vanilla enemies.

Maybe something like killing your pet pinkie as it's been getting quite old, arthritic and sickly lately, but I'm already feeling bad just thinking about it. >_>

Absolutely delicious WAD. I was actually pretty afraid around the Object 15 area, I was expecting something, anything to suddenly happen.

What does the Russian text in a wall near the exit means, though?
If anyone here speaks Russian, here it is:

Archi said:

I'd like to contribute if I can see something that I like other than words.

Oh, it WILL happen. I am just looking for some posts like yours, letting the concept sink for a bit, taking a few notes here, a few suggestions there... And of course, gauging interest. If this thread had died in a pair of posts, I wouldn't have bothered.
You can be sure this will get somewhere before the end of this month.

What do you mean by "simple combat" though? I did play the original RE but simple would be one of the last words I'd use to define its combat.

Alright, where's my notepad...

@Royal_Sir: I'm not completely sold on variety. The more maps, the more mellowed out the experience; unless one can keep the quality level constant.
Still, if you don't mind, I might rework your idea. Hell, I am working with something similar on an experimental level, using subtractive / negative dynamic lights that suck your health away if you got too close.


@gemini09: Maybe an earthquake or maybe some script to randomly push the player sideways, while you're trying not to fall into the UACtreet(tm) or collide into other things... It's quite dumb, but it could work.
And yeah, while I'd rather not make glitches mandatory, I guess I could do what I did in my Shrooms WAD and hide easter eggs for getting into silly places.


@Angry Saint: Maybe. I'd hate to keep this completely tied into a story, but at the same time that's what people are insisting on.
I'd very much rather have a more abstract hub. At least if I end up making it, I'm terrible with realistic spaces in Doom.
And thanks a lot for mentioning Foreverhood, been meaning to replay it forever but couldn't remember its name.


@joe-ilya & dugan: Thanks, I'll look into those WADs to see what they did right and what didn't work for them.

gemini09 said:

I think something like Monkey Island would be the most fun. I'm not so keen on any more surreal stuff since we already have more than enough in regular Doom, so a walking-simulator should also be more ordinary in its locations, IMO.

Nothing technically stops us from taking a more LSD: Dream Emulator approach. There's some places that are very normal, some are quite normal but there's a giant horse galloping on the distance, then you get into really dream-like material.

Great, you gave me a perfect storyline for a level. Doomkid gets up to go to school, eats breakfast, gets his backpack then he starts to run late, finally when he gets to school he finds out there's a Demonology test which he hasn't studied for. We then make some trivia questions about Doom's enemies, which the player answers in a multiple choice fashion. Get all of them right and you get some easter egg or a useless powerup.

@Doom14: I just realized, is that a 3d sloped floor as ceiling? Dude, I want you in my mapping team, you know your s***.
And yes, this will get up and running. The only problem is getting at least 3 or so mappers. I can do half of the maps, but I honestly don't feel like a project with the idea of "dreams" would do well with just one mapper. It would get stuck into the same mindset for all maps.

Doom14 said:

My suggestion is that if you're going to focus on a non-combative approach, interactivity, aesthetics, and MUSIC SELECTION are pivotal.

This is obvious, at least to me, but thanks for saying it.

I was aiming for minimalistic or more ambient music, as that's easier to fit.
As for interactivity, I already had plans for a zone called Logician Nightmare with many, many puzzles. It's interesting how it's complicated to make a really compelling puzzle when all you've got is a state machine in the scripting.

Some other stuff like a void.wad hunt to find the skulls or other items to place them somewhere else is to be expected.

As for what I already have planned:
- I'm shamelessly going to copy the visuals of the White Desert of Yume Nikki. It's not my fault I had a dream a few years ago that was in that place, and the "storyline" of the dream would fit a Doom level.
- I've had dreams about Doom levels since forever, and while they were always interesting to see, they would play like crap with monsters. Feels like a good opportunity to put the ideas out.
- Nightmare-like parts like being trapped under a crusher with controls locked.
- A level inspired on a certain dream I had where I needed to hunt a few peanuts for a wizard. Don't want to spoil it too much, I'll just say that the peanuts weren't your normal peanuts.

I might be going overboard on the grass? (don't worry, that's a single sector, I learned what making that many sectors in a small space causes around 10 years ago)

I might also be going overboard with lighting, just a liiiiiiiiittle bit.

Absolutely Killed.

VERY fresh and quirky, great use of all features, and most importantly it isn't a goddamn 9000+ monsters slaughterwad like most of last year's Cacowards.

Also,
+ e1m8b.wad
+ bstain.wad

Ryathaen said:

I take it you didn't like the secret map? Is there something in particular that could be tweaked?

Sorry, I don't know much about Brutal Doom. Why is M1 impossible to beat with it?

The secret map is kinda slow paced thanks to the floors and is as hard as the last level thanks to the sniper abuse. Both things are just my particular opinion, I'm sure some of the pro players here would love it. You could add some more health on HMP and lower, though.

As for Brutal Doom, the barrels explode MUCH faster. You can't get halfway through the first corridor before they catch up. There's no easy way to fix it, but in BD you can push against barrels to move them, so maybe with some empty recesses around where you fall into that area, you could break the puzzle to make it completable.
Not worth a fix if you ask me, really.

After seeing this post by Linguica and a recent thread by a now-banned user called Megasphere, the idea of a walking simulator was floating in the back of my mind.

First of all, I already know this is kinda dumb. That's not the point. The point is, can we make something that's moderately fun while having little to no things to shoot?

Now this is the part I want feedback on:
My idea is for something between Hexen and Yume Nikki. A central hub with more or less a dozen entrances to separate "dreams" or worlds. Each of those has a very distinct theme, ranging from the inside of a mansion to something like void.wad to a street of a small countryside town to a nightmare deep in hell. In each of those, which are somewhat similar in concept to MAP13: Downtown (lots of rooms which are ultimately useless to complete the map, but pleasant to finish/solve), you walk around, admiring the scenery and maybe solving a few puzzles, preferably with heavy scripting (I can make scripts if needed).

• Each level will have a button that does something to the main hub, and when all are pressed, you can proceed to the end of the game.
  
• Each level can also have a powerup that allows the player to get to new places: A pistol with infinite ammo, jumping, crouching, a modified plasma rifle that shoots water so you can "kill" blocking fire things in the hell levels... And some useless ones like a non-blocking Lost Soul that follows you everywhere.
  
• Combat would be non-existant. Maybe you could have to dodge revenant rockets as you run through an open area, maybe you might find a bunch of cyberdemons firing in straight lines and you need to weave through the rockets as you advance... Stuff like CyberDreams, you know.
  
• Obviously, since the biggest point of the thing would be aesthetics, this would target GZDoom. Don't know which version, but the last stable one should be a good start, right?
  
• --------------------
  
• Question time:
  
• What are good limits for adding new textures? I don't want to stifle people's creativity but also don't want to end up with a 300MB download.
  
• What are some good, surreal, dream-like or plain weird wads? I know of void.wad, gravity.wad, imposs.wad... Those 3 are the kind of aesthetics we'd be aiming for. The gameplay of The Sky May Be also fits, but the visuals... Not so much.
  
• Would it be better to have a few big maps where 2 or more mappers work in tandem in a single map, or smaller and more plentiful maps?
  
• Would a time limit of a year or two be good enough? I don't want this to become another Mordeth, but at the same time I know how making really good maps takes a lot of time. Hell, I took a year to make 4 maps for my first WAD.
  

I know this is a bit vague for now, but I only started to seriously think on how it could work this afternoon and realized it's too much work for one person to undertake.

Finally, don't worry. I'll admit I'm inexperienced within the Doomworld community, but I've ran a few community projects in other forums, and I definitely know my way around ACS and the insides of a WAD. I won't disappear from this unless I get hit by a literal or metaphorical bus. Even if for some reason I get absolutely displeased by the whole community, I'll see this to the end or find a trustful replacement before disappearing.

Alright, this was an awesome ride almost from start to end. Other than the secret map, all of the maps get 5 stars from me.

I have a few small things to note:

In E1M4, I came from the secret level with 12 health. Cue 3 damaging sectors straight away. Maybe add a medkit right at the start?

In E1M6, the first spider mastermind room has 2 stray BIGDOOR1 textures.


Oh, and good work on making level 1 impossible to beat with Brutal Doom. I can already see lots of little kids angry and cussing your ancestors to the 343rd generation :P
(Well, it might be possible if you can push the barrels around to break the explosions... Not gonna test that anyway.)

Alright then, here's my map, updated for the newest version of the texture pack you posted:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dc9ryclr6n8jsvp/MAP13.wad?dl=1

Title: El Dorado
Players: Single player, will add coop support later
Compatibility: -complevel 9
Midi: Moonspell - A Werewolf Masquerade (temporary, maybe)


It's 100% playable but about 50% done as of this post, with the following still required before it's definitely something I'm proud of (Will keep editing this post until it's done):

1. Fix the blue and red switches opening the doors on the alternate temples
   
2. A little bit more of ammo here, a little less ammo there as per an_mutt's post above (not too much, infighting on a pistol start will still be a smart idea unless you're Mike Tyson)
   
3. Make decent outside areas that aren't a single height level - Forget it, what I wanted to do is impossible without spending far more time than what I'm willing to commit. I learned something out of it at least.
   
4. Hell, make most areas have more than a single height level
   
5. Detail the final arena like my life depended on it - Could be better, but lack of inspiration and fear of changing the gameplay struck.
   
6. Make the damn floor crack in the north temple far more noticeable as even I myself forgot about it until making this post
   
7. Think on some interesting visuals for the north temple (note to myself, broken walls where you can see through them like the door)
   
8. Coop starts
   

an_mutt said:

If someone can suggest a more efficient fix or - more preferably - go through the resource pack and rename the offending textures, I'd be eternally grateful. This will probably cause a number of mappers to have to go back to their wads and change some flats to the same flats with the new updated filenames, which I can only apologise for. This is really a mistake on my behalf, and my inexperience in not spotting that some of the flats I chose were initially given the same name as doom2.wad flats.

I'll do it right now. Doom Builder has a sturdy search-and-replace function, so it won't really be a problem for the mappers. Worst case, they spend 10 minutes getting to know one of the most underused and best features of the program.
Hell, if we were mapping in UDMF, I could write a python script or something to automatically fix the maps. >_>
Here it is: https://www.dropbox.com/s/v0kgsh3zptx3jkm/n3txv1.1.wad?dl=1
Changes:

And now for something completely different, El Dorado is playable! Grab it while there's still gold in its streets, people: https://www.dropbox.com/s/xw4zorjt8iqnfag/MAP13.wad?dl=1
Updated version for the new texture WAD: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0j37nlmx6y9sfbf/MAP13_2.wad?dl=0

Looking for feedback on: The song used, which is not vanilla compatible anyway; the difficulty level (it's supposed to be medium-hard), and suggestions for visuals.
Keep in mind, the outside areas and the final arena are definitely bland, I'll add some snazz and pizzazz and sparkles to them later.

It will work, but I have a feeling an_mutt will kill you. >_>

It'd be easier for you and him if you just copied the doom 2 textures you want to use and renamed them to something like BNJ_001, 002, etc.

Benjogami said:

If I switch the order of the resources (put DOOM2 on top), Doom Builder starts showing what I see in game.

That's exactly what you need to do.

If you want a technical explanation, it loads the Nova textures, then it loads the Doom 2 textures. If for some reason two textures have the same name, then it uses the last one to be loaded. In this case, it's Doom 2's textures.
When you test the map, the game loads them in the opposite order and it ends up showing Nova's textures.

If you really want to use that floor texture, then you'll have to add it to Nova's texture pack under a different name... I have no idea how to do that, I've never modded vanilla Doom, only ZDoom. This guide works for ZDoom, though.
https://wiki.srb2.org/wiki/Custom_textures_tutorial_-_SLADE

It's been a while since playing a WAD on HNTR made me long for playing Stardate or similar slaughterwads on UV.

The concept is good and the execution is flawless, really.

@scifista42, Angry Saint: That's not a bad idea. I might just go on realm667 and hunt some evil looking Things.

You know what Megasphere, this thread inspired me. My next map for ZDoom will have some sort of heavily scripted puzzle that will require you to walk around for ages.

Yeah, looks pretty empty but I love the ground texture. Makes me want to eat a chocolate cookie.

I've been toying with "negative" light when I get bored of mapping for NOVA:

Gustavo6046 said:

Not exactly a picture, but...
http://i.imgur.com/0iTw5hFl.png

Try using this song with it :P

Doomkid said:

I'm interested how you determined it to be 39 years until that becomes passable?

There's a text file inside the zip. Read it and your questions shall be answered.

On a sidenote, I'd love to be able to see the contents of https://www.doomworld.com/linguica/hax/ for obvious reasons.

Pretty good map. On UV I finished it with like 100 bullets and 30 shells. (only saw that it was medium and easy-only after playing it, don't know how much of a difference it makes)
The secrets were pretty easy to find and the first one made me laugh. Seriously, a measly stimpack? Next time put ten health bonuses so it feels a bit more of a reward.

As the other poster said, the texturing could use a bit of work, and the maze was only acceptable because it was pretty short.

Finally, you should test it on ZDoom, in the round room with the lift that had a battle with a Baron, the button glitched for me. The button there lowers to the lowest floor, which was the small tunnel that alerts the other monsters. The easiest fix is to raise that sound tunnel to the top of the room, make it 1 unit tall. No-one is going to notice a 1-pixel hole if you use textures of the same color.