[CP] [DSDA CL2] Super Doom TV - [RC1]

[Eon Toad]

Thanks

[Eon Toad]

I've updated Multiversal with the suggested changes and replaced the portal texture with one that's a bit less fun but hopefully still conveys the idea of a portal. Here's the updated link:

 

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/ixgseg7aqgob1/5+-+Multiversal

[galileo31dos01]

Hello, I played this recently, maps 1-14 in crispy, switched to dsda-doom for 15 and rest because of fps issues before. Very good set, very good quality of gameplay, neat clever concepts and gimmicks like the "no monsters" one which was my favorite, and lots and lots of gibbing zombies, and the plethora of secrets in map 15, yeah so much goodness. I admit the 3-4 levels of spike of difficulty at the final map's challenge, next to the entire rest of the set, wore me down a bit after trying my best to stop slipping off platforms incessantly. That's okay, what is a proper finale without throwing everything you got!

 

On another side, the map order in the OP doesn't match the actual order in the wad (e.g. "Bonus Prizes" is 13), though probably that's the order for which the maps were submitted here.

 

I see that most of the issues that I found myself were already reported, so have a few extra minor observations:

 

Spoiler

21 "Liquids Heats"

- A slime trail over here

 

32 "Splutterpunk Junction"

- Not necessarily an issue, though there were some pain elementals unable to give birth as is the case in vanilla doom and the 21 lost soul limit, which I mention in case it wasn't intentional.

 

15 "Studio Scramble"

- Not a serious issue but I'd like to suggest relocating this green armor that seems you can't avoid picking up before the plasma gun setup. That 81% in the status bar was blue armor from a secret, which turned into less useful green. 

 

12 "Power Crowd"

- Noticed this ugly texture cutoff here. 

 

- A typo in this intermission text, specifically where it says [...] inflitrted [...]

- For users of other non-umapinfo ports like crispy doom, there could be a dehacked patch with the correct titles in the automap. Also m09's is missing a CWILV08 lump so it appears as The Pit in the tally screen.

 

Thanks for making this! 

[Emperor S P O O N]

Spoiler

18 hours ago, galileo31dos01 said:

21 "Liquids Heats"

- A slime trail over here

 

@Lorcav fixed the slimetrail.
LiquidHeat_v3.zip

[Ar_e_en]

On 1/9/2024 at 6:08 AM, galileo31dos01 said:

 

  Hide contents

15 "Studio Scramble"

- Not a serious issue but I'd like to suggest relocating this green armor that seems you can't avoid picking up before the plasma gun setup. That 81% in the status bar was blue armor from a secret, which turned into less useful green. 

 

 

I too wouldn't consider this to be a huge issue, although I get your point - It is possible to get to this point with a secret blue armour, but then have it be invalidated with the non-secret green armour. If there are any more obvious issues in the map (that can be corrected in a editor without screwing over some of the scripted segments) - I would probably fix them and also change up the green armour placement as well. As for now - I don't think that there is anything major that needs to be changed up.

[Lorcav]

All map updates have been added in the beta link in the OP: Tyrant Time Traveler, Watch Your Step, Liquid Heat and Multiversal

 

On 1/9/2024 at 4:08 AM, galileo31dos01 said:

 

 

  Hide contents

 

- A typo in this intermission text, specifically where it says [...] inflitrted [...]

- For users of other non-umapinfo ports like crispy doom, there could be a dehacked patch with the correct titles in the automap. Also m09's is missing a CWILV08 lump so it appears as The Pit in the tally screen.

 

 

Fixed the typo in the text.
I can't recreate the issue you're having with MAP09, is it happening in DSDA or just Crispy Doom?
Regarding your note on map 13, the order was updated on a subsequant post as I made a bit of a mess of it originally.

 

 

[galileo31dos01]

1 hour ago, Lorcav said:

I can't recreate the issue you're having with MAP09, is it happening in DSDA or just Crispy Doom?

 

There's no CWILV08 in the current public release, so the title the game displays is the original's map name in crispy but the new name does appear in dsda-doom. 

 

 

 

[Lorcav]

49 minutes ago, galileo31dos01 said:

 

There's no CWILV08 in the current public release, so the title the game displays is the original's map name in crispy but the new name does appear in dsda-doom. 

 

 

 

It's probably down to the UMAPINFO defining the map name graphics based on what they were in the very original map allocations before some people dropped out and the order was changed to smooth the difficulty curve.

For example:

 

[Ar_e_en]

I did a very quick run through all of the maps to see how things have progressed.

Here are my notes:

Spoiler

 

Map 05 "Turtles Nearby"

---
    Same problem as before! 
    Lines #1954, #1970, #1979, #1949, #1972, #1959, #1976, #1960, #1518, #1510, #1502, #1515, #1520, #1513, #1517, #1491, #3231 and #3233 need to have their texture offsets changed slightly (mostly vertical offsets, but a few need some horizontal changes as well)
???
    Same problem as before!
     The visuals in this map are made with boom features. Changing all the STARTAN textures over to a pure black texture would be a nice compromise.

 

Map 10 "Tyrant Time Traveler"

---
    Same problem as before!
     Sector #431 (it has a tag of 20) can't move down, causing the monsters inside to be stuck in the closet forever. Either the monsters need to be moved around a bit, be given a bigger room or one of them needs to be removed (possibly Thing #75).
    
     
Map 14 "Watch Your Step"

---     
     New issue !!!
     Line #2625 seems to be a boom line action special and it needs to be replaced with a vanilla action. I don't think that I ran into this problem in the previous version of the map, so maybe this was a new problem that accidentally got added.
---
     New issue !!!
     The textures of Lines #2583 and #1985 seem to be misaligned. I think this issue was in the previous version, but I simply didn't spot it before.
     
      

Map 17 "Fortress Of The Horned Beast"

---
    Same issue as before!
    One of the secrets is made with boom features, it needs to be redesigned. I do have a suggestion on how to make this work in vanilla: delete the boom conveyor room (as well as the voodoo doll), take the 3 switches that originally opened the doors and change them to switches that activate crushers, create the 3 crusher rooms somewhere out of bounds (far enough that the crusher sounds can't be heard), in each crusher room - place a Commander Keen and change the door to the secret teleporter so that it has a tag of 666.

 

Map 18 "Rock It, Man!"

---
    Same issue as before!
    The Arachnotrons on Sector #245 and especially Sector #237 have a lot of trouble hitting you when the windows lower. The ones on Sector #237 can't hit you at all!
---
    Same issue as before!
    The monsters on the out of bounds Sectors #838 and #827 can't teleport out because Sector #828 doesn't lower to the bottom floor! 

REMINDER: Both of these issues can probably be fixed by changing the actions of the Lines #1029 and #3553 to the actions that simply lower the sectors to the lowest floor (Action 38 or 82).
     
     

 

Map 20 "Witness Total Carnage"     
--- 
    The animated bars before the final teleporter (around the area of X = -1792, Y = 1888), are fixed for the most part, but the Lines #3184 and #3190 are still animated in the wrong way (these animated lines are only noticeable only when you look at the bars from one side)
    
    
Map 24 (The credits map)
---
    Same issue as before!
    Line #338 has a misaligned texture.

 

 

[Lorcav]

Thanks @Ar_e_en

 

Additional map feedback for @JacaCaca @RiviTheWarlock @RED77 @EagerBeaver @Endless

 

I'll update my credit map note this morning.

[EagerBeaver]

Sorry for being a slacker. I made all needed edits to my maps according to @Ar_e_en advice.

 

I re-made the switch puzzle in "Fortress...", using Keens. Also, I removed rooms with arachnos from "Rock It, Man", because they seemed redundant and useless to me.

 

PS - The maps still use old numbers 21 and 22.

Super Doom TV - Eager Beaver edited maps.7z

[Ar_e_en]

1 hour ago, EagerBeaver said:

Sorry for being a slacker. I made all needed edits to my maps according to @Ar_e_en advice.

 

I re-made the switch puzzle in "Fortress...", using Keens. Also, I removed rooms with arachnos from "Rock It, Man", because they seemed redundant and useless to me.

 

PS - The maps still use old numbers 21 and 22.

Super Doom TV - Eager Beaver edited maps.7z

I quickly checked these map. "Rock It, Man" seems to work fine now! However,  in "Fortress Of The Horned Beast" the switches that activate the crushers  (Lines #546, #1533 and #218)  seem to be made with line actions that are available only in the boom format (Action type 165). They should be changed to Action type 49 (which to my knowledge is the only vanilla crusher action that can be activated by a switch).

 

I also want to add an extra note about one of the new issues on Map 14 "Watch Your Step" (which was made by @RED77 from what I understand). As stated before: In map 14 - the switch at Line #2625 is now a boom line action. The Action type there is 166, which should probably be changed to a simple "door stay open" action (I think that Action type 103 should do the trick).

[EagerBeaver]

2 hours ago, Ar_e_en said:

They should be changed to Action type 49 (which to my knowledge is the only vanilla crusher action that can be activated by a switch). 

 

 

Aaaand... Updated!

Fortress.7z

[Ar_e_en]

1 hour ago, EagerBeaver said:

 

Aaaand... Updated!

Fortress.7z

I'm so sorry to report this, but I just remembered another mistake that I forgot to mention in my previous post! The room that opens after the keens are crushed is tagged as a secret twice! Again, I apologise for forgetting this!

 

That being said, I tested this newer version and the secret door finally works as it should!

[EagerBeaver]

I hope, this was the last bug :P

 

 

Fortress of The Horned Beast 1.42.7z

[Ar_e_en]

2 hours ago, EagerBeaver said:

I hope, this was the last bug :P

 

 

Fortress of The Horned Beast 1.42.7z

Did another run through the map and I'm happy to say that everything seems to be in order!

[RED77]

10 hours ago, Ar_e_en said:

I quickly checked these map. "Rock It, Man" seems to work fine now! However,  in "Fortress Of The Horned Beast" the switches that activate the crushers  (Lines #546, #1533 and #218)  seem to be made with line actions that are available only in the boom format (Action type 165). They should be changed to Action type 49 (which to my knowledge is the only vanilla crusher action that can be activated by a switch).

 

I also want to add an extra note about one of the new issues on Map 14 "Watch Your Step" (which was made by @RED77 from what I understand). As stated before: In map 14 - the switch at Line #2625 is now a boom line action. The Action type there is 166, which should probably be changed to a simple "door stay open" action (I think that Action type 103 should do the trick).

 

thanks for the feedback. I'll make sure to address the problem ASAP

 

 

[Lorcav]

9 hours ago, Ar_e_en said:

Did another run through the map and I'm happy to say that everything seems to be in order!

 

Both maps have been updated in the Beta WAD

[RED77]

ok, map updated, plus I found two minor misalignments that I've solved too.

 

CP_SDTV_MAP07_WATCH_YOUR_STP_V3_BY_RED77.rar

[Hydrus]

There are some annoying HOM effects in map 5 in DSDA-doom. Also, it's possible to trigger the all-ghosts effect in map 3. I've only played to map 6 so far; will tell you if I encounter any more bugs.

[Ar_e_en]

11 hours ago, Hydrus said:

Also, it's possible to trigger the all-ghosts effect in map 3.

This project is set as a Limit-Removing project, so you should probably disable the intercepts overflow emulation option. I once forgot to disable that option when I was testing Map 31 and I experienced the all-ghosts bug all the time in that map.

[Lorcav]

OK, @RED77 I've updated your map in the beta wad. 

 

Which just leaves two more jobs (currently) I'll update the map name graphics and umapinfo to accomodate the issue raised by @galileo31dos01 

 

There seem to be some fixes needed for Map05 Turtles Nearby by @RiviTheWarlock, or alternatively if someone can recap the fix for me I can try and update it directly.

[Ar_e_en]

On 1/16/2024 at 6:50 PM, Lorcav said:

There seem to be some fixes needed for Map05 Turtles Nearby by @RiviTheWarlock, or alternatively if someone can recap the fix for me I can try and update it directly.

It's not really a fix, it's more of a compromise. Basically, the main thing to do is find all instances of STARTAN and replace them with all black textures. Besides that - there are a few side textures that are connected to door opening sectors that need to have their texture offsets fixed (possibly by setting then to lower-unpegged) and (as an additional compromise for the visuals being screwed) the map exit sector might need to be raised by 8 units (otherwise DSDA might only show half of the exit texture). 

[RiviTheWarlock]

I rarely check DW, have the fixes been made or should I fire up Doombuilder?

On 1/18/2024 at 5:47 AM, Ar_e_en said:

It's not really a fix, it's more of a compromise. Basically, the main thing to do is find all instances of STARTAN and replace them with all black textures. Besides that - there are a few side textures that are connected to door opening sectors that need to have their texture offsets fixed (possibly by setting then to lower-unpegged) and (as an additional compromise for the visuals being screwed) the map exit sector might need to be raised by 8 units (otherwise DSDA might only show half of the exit texture). 

 

[Ar_e_en]

2 hours ago, RiviTheWarlock said:

I rarely check DW, have the fixes been made or should I fire up Doombuilder?

 

The fixes/compromises haven't been made. If you want to take a shot at fixing them, here is a list:

Spoiler

 

Map 05 "Turtles Nearby"

Generic issue:
---
    Lines #1954, #1970, #1979, #1949, #1972, #1959, #1976, #1960, #1518, #1510, #1502, #1515, #1520, #1513, #1517, #1491, #3231 and #3233 need some texture offset fixes (most if not all of these are touching door sectors and once the doors open - the textures become misaligned. Checking the "Lower-Unpegged" flag and doing some minor alignment fixes might be the solution to this issue).

Spoiler

 

Most of the misaligned lines are like this.

Issues caused by the use of Boom features while in complevel 2 (occur in DSDA, PRBoom+ and possibly Crispy Doom as well. However - Woof doesn't experience these issues):
---
     Changing all the STARTAN textures over to a pure black texture would be a nice compromise.

Spoiler

---
     Raise the exit teleporter by 8 units, otherwise the exit sign might be cut off in DSDA/PRBoom+.

Spoiler

---
    The sides that touch the walls of the exit door look off in DSDA/PRBoom+. Might be a good idea to remake that door so that it doesn't touch the 2 sides and simply lies in the middle of the sector. NOTE: If you decide to make this change, then 2 of the misaligned lines that were mentioned above might have to be erased. 

Spoiler

---
    These sectors cause HOMs in DSDA/PRBoom+. 

Spoiler

 

 

[RiviTheWarlock]

Well it's all complevel issues so the map is kind of fucked. Unless you want to arduously go through and make everything a self-referencing sector, and even then that would break the light bridge effect. The entire map is using Boom features because that was the intent of the map. I don't remember the comp level ever being specified, and a I obviously can't check that original version of the post. Of course it could just be I fucked up and made the map in Boom w/o thinking about it. Either way the map is probabily going to need to be withdrawn from the project.

[Ar_e_en]

It's a cool map and I think it would be a shame to see it go to waste. How about I try my hand at fixing up the issues? I may not be able to make it 100% vanilla/limit-removing (I could never figure out how to make self referencing-sectors), but since most of the map issues for this map have been reported by me - I should be able to bring this map to a better state. 

 

Do I have your permission to try and fix this?

[Lorcav]

Ageed, it'd be a shame to lose it.

 

If an updated version that attends to the issues can be created (by either @RiviTheWarlock or @Ar_e_en) i'll include it in the beta wad. 

 

This is the last map with any outstanding notes I think. So once it's updated il I think we're close to a final release. 

 

 

[Ar_e_en]

Alright, I'm currently working on it. Hopefully - it won't take weeks to finish.

 

[Ar_e_en]

Here's the fixed map: SDTV_Map05_fix.zip

 

I fixed the texture alignments (even discovered a few new ones), got rid of most of the HOMs (there are still 1 or 2 spots where you can see some very minor HOMs, but it's only noticeable if you have freelook enabled and you look down), tried to implement some fixes for some theoretical multiplayer softlocks, I replaced the STARTAN textures with all black colors and I did 2 very minor visual changes to the exit area - I changed the big golden door into a golden lowering platform (the door version was causing some HOMs) and I added some decorative green lines to the exit platform.

 

I did my testing with complevel 2 in both DSDA and Woof (I still wanted the map to look as it did in Woof, which caused me to actually add more Boom line specials into the map, which are thankfully ignored by DSDA). There is still a possibility that some visual effects may break in multiplayer games, but my main focus was to get the singleplayer to be visually consistent.

I hope I didn't ruin the original vision of the map with my fixes and compromises, and I also hope I didn't introduce any new bugs into this version, but I think that the map still functions as it originally did.