MAYhem 2023 - Uploaded!

[MObreck]

Been busy, but I've gotten through the first six stages. No new major issues to report thus far.

 

EDIT: Made it to level 9, everything seems functioning the way it was intended thus far. Didn't find all the secrets but got 100% kills on every stage on EV.

Edited September 20, 2023 by MObreck : More progress

[Biodegradable]

On 9/16/2023 at 7:57 PM, Obsidian said:

I'm gonna try and get this all done by the end of the month, but I'll need some more testing to be done before I make any further changes: so far we've had...erm, two people who've done testing. I'll ask around, but in the meantime I'm more than happy for people to give any feedback they feel is appropriate.

 

Mayhem needs more testers, you say? Not a problem, Obs. I can take the new beta for a spin after dinner this evening. ;^)

[Obsidian]

You are a blessing, good sir. :D

[Biodegradable]

Okay kids, here's some footage of the first eight maps. I really like it so far, everyone's maps have been visually diverse and good fun. Only possibly bug I personally noticed was what might've been a misbehaving trigger line for a monster closet on @Worm318's map. Everything else seems A-OK, but the footage is there for everyone to scour through in case they see something's not working or whatever. I'll see if I can knock the rest out tomorrow!

 

 

[plums]

I can give this a spin but not for a few days, so depending on how big & tough the maps are it might not be quick enough for your end-of-the-month deadline. If there are any maps that should be prioritized let me know. Also I have basically no experience with Eternity as a mapping format or port to play in, but that shouldn't be too big a deal.

[Redead-ITA]

3 hours ago, Biodegradable said:

Only possibly bug I personally noticed was what might've been a misbehaving trigger line for a monster closet 

Or it could be because you are testing it in gzdoom and not Eternity engine as it was Noted by the Obsidian in the start of the thread. 

Though i would want to point it out, but i am not sure if you can run eternity formatted maps on gzdoom.

[Biodegradable]

4 hours ago, Redead-ITA said:

Or it could be because you are testing it in gzdoom and not Eternity engine as it was Noted by the Obsidian in the start of the thread. 

Though i would want to point it out, but i am not sure if you can run eternity formatted maps on gzdoom.

 

Right. I think the Boom format plus the "UDMF" parts threw me for a loop and I figured GZ would be able to run 'em fine. If this absolutely needs Eternity, then I apologise for wasting everyone's time.

[Obsidian]

Hey, the fact that you volunteered your time is still appreciated. And considering seven of the eight maps you played were Boom format anyway, your feedback is definitely still useful. :)

[Biodegradable]

That's very reassuring. Thanks, Obs. :^)

[Worm318]

9 hours ago, Biodegradable said:

Only possibly bug I personally noticed was what might've been a misbehaving trigger line for a monster closet on @Worm318's map.

 

That was not a bug, those monsters that you missed were part of the outdoor secret area.

 

The actual bug that you encounter was the green switch not raising the stairs when you pressed it the first time. I will see if I can make it more reliable as it is a multi-line switch and probably the lines are too close to the player.

 

Thanks for your playtrough.

[MObreck]

Played all the way up to level 11.

 

This isn't so much a bug report so much as an observation: it is impossible to trigger one of the secrets in Map11 (Washed Out by @Salmon) unless freelook is enabled. Here is the secret in question:

 

If this Community Project was meant to be played with freelook enabled then no problem. If not then this secret's switch should be lowered a bit so it can be activated without freelook. Fun, surreal map BTW.

 

It was also fun to see the ambush of Grells from my MEDB pack on Level 6.

 

Also here is a minor patch for my level. Since the custom vent busting sound effect wasn't transferred to the official project this updated version uses a stock sound effect whenever a vent is busted in my level:

OutsideBoxPatched.zip

 

Edited September 23, 2023 by MObreck

[Salmon]

@MObreck, thanks, I appreciate the testing!  I was surprised to see you say that since I never play or test with freelook and honestly kind of hate secrets that require it.  I'm unable to reproduce the issue you're talking about using the 0.2 version of the project and the most recent EE dev build from September 10th.  I was able to tag both shoot switches in the map from a variety of angles with all the hitscan weapons and the fist.  Would you mind looking at it again if you get the chance?  And if anyone else wants to have a look, that'd be great too.

[Insaneprophet]

10 hours ago, MObreck said:

Played all the way up to level 11.

 

This isn't so much a bug report so much as an observation: it is impossible to trigger one of the secrets in Map11 (Washed Out by @Salmon) unless freelook is enabled. Here is the secret in question:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

40 minutes ago, Salmon said:

@MObreck, thanks, I appreciate the testing!  I was surprised to see you say that since I never play or test with freelook and honestly kind of hate secrets that require it.  I'm unable to reproduce the issue you're talking about using the 0.2 version of the project and the most recent EE dev build from September 10th.  I was able to tag both shoot switches in the map from a variety of angles with all the hitscan weapons and the fist.  Would you mind looking at it again if you get the chance?  And if anyone else wants to have a look, that'd be great too.

 It would be just slightly ammusing if he was accidentally playing the entire map while crouched 😃... just sayin

[MObreck]

1 hour ago, Salmon said:

@MObreck, thanks, I appreciate the testing!  I was surprised to see you say that since I never play or test with freelook and honestly kind of hate secrets that require it.  I'm unable to reproduce the issue you're talking about using the 0.2 version of the project and the most recent EE dev build from September 10th.  I was able to tag both shoot switches in the map from a variety of angles with all the hitscan weapons and the fist.  Would you mind looking at it again if you get the chance?  And if anyone else wants to have a look, that'd be great too.

 

Ok I know what I did wrong. I still had another mod wad installed that adds Heretic style liquid physics to the game, which was placing the player too low to reach the switch. Nevermind.

 

47 minutes ago, Insaneprophet said:

 

 It would be just slightly ammusing if he was accidentally playing the entire map while crouched 😃... just sayin

 

This community project must be run in Eternity Engine, which does not support crouching.

[plums]

Quick questions, is Eternity demo-stable? (I assume no unless you're using the -vanilla parameter which doesn't work here; hopefully demos are compatible between different OSes if it's the same engine version.) If I do FDAs will it be helpful, and will anyone be able to watch them since it looks like the project needs a devbuild of EE? Is it better to do the Boom-format maps in dsda-doom with -complevel 9 (or 21)?

Edited September 24, 2023 by plums

[Worm318]

Update to my map: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kv1yh-fd-i8lFlLjj3wPDezW4nX8x2HM/view?usp=drive_link

Changelog:
- Tried to make the stair raise switches more reliable
- Changed the secret switches a bit to make them more easy to spot
- Put something silly on TV c:

[plums]

OK, just got done playing through the wad. In general I thought it was quite good, gameplay was highly inconsistent varied from one map to the next, even for a community project, but the visuals gave it some cohesiveness and made it look like everyone put at least a moderate amount of effort into them. I am curious why the custom monsters were Eternity format-only, since the wad as a whole only loads in Eternity and the monster resources were for MBF21. Oh well, far too late to change that.

 

FDAs for all! https://user.fm/files/v2-0de27a339bf14704c73f92033c453b87/mayhem2023_0.2_plumsfdas.zip

Like I just said the wad only loads in Eternity so rather than make a separate Boom-format map I just did them all in EE. Plays back in the latest devbuild from https://devbuilds.drdteam.org/eternity/ (pre-1227, Sept 10 2023), other versions untested. I think EE isn't demo-stable, so these will only work on that version, which could be a problem if people are hoping their maps are eligible for DSDA demo recording. [edit: looks like this will probably be fixed for the final release, see discussion with MObreck below.]

 

Eternity lacks demo features like fast-forward so I'm not going to be upset if someone doesn't want to watch me play their map, especially the later ones. I don't finish the map on a lot of them, in those cases I went back to play it with saves. I also usually went back to find all secrets. (You can change the playback speed by changing the value of realtic_clock_rate in system.cfg for Eternity, but AFAICT you can't adjust it in-game.)

 

Brief comments for each map. Spoilers ahead, I don't want to spoiler-block the whole thing because that will be annoying so just skip the rest of this gigantic post to avoid them.

 

*****

 

MAP01: Not much to say here, short and sweet map. Liked the texture choice. Kind of indifferent about the secret at the end like that, I guess it's fine.

 

MAP02: Good map. Secrets are pretty much freebies. Kind of easier than the first one. I shotgunned too many barons because it was safe to do so and had a surplus of shells, it's not like I needed to save the rockets though so maybe that one's on me.

 

MAP03: I was thinking this was easy until I took a rev rocket to the face and died. And then proceeded to be unable to dodge them at all. Still adjusting to Eternity, yeah, that's it. As such I couldn't tell if health was a bit low, or if that was intentional by a mapper named NeedHealth, or it was just me playing poorly. Secrets were pretty hidden, I was able to barely bump that armour at the end.

 

MAP04: This was fun and I really liked the nonlinearity, especially if you find the backpack. The double AV surprise is a massive spike in difficulty in a map that is moderately easy otherwise, I didn't mind it so much but it was kind of out of place? The switches to lower/raise the stairs can be mashed back and forth to get some stairs to rise without others, revealing missing textures, but I couldn't break anything with them otherwise. (I haven't played the update posted above so maybe that is fixed now?)

 

MAP05: Short and violent. A big step up in difficulty from the previous maps, but that's OK. It did end sooner than I expected, and I didn't like the invisible walkover end linedef moving towards what looked like an exit door -- at least make the door tex the endswitch IMO. I get a bit lost in the switchhunt because of the constant pressure from enemies, but I figured it out after not too long.

I don't know if you're meant to be able to camp away from those cyberdemons after you get the red key. OTOH there's very little health outside the secret soulsphere, so it's not like I minded.

I guess there's no way back after teleporting, meaning you can easily miss the secret exit if you don't know about it. Maybe you didn't want people to have a BFG for the first secret map.

 

SECRET01: Pretty dark and tense the whole time! Low ammo and low health. Do I make it out alive or not? When you spawn shotgun guys by getting the red key, you can actually repeat making them spawn in multiple times or maybe infinitely, which I would have done in the demo if I knew it was possible to farm them for shells. This also messes with the kill count but maybe that's just how Eternity works?

 

MAP06: Didn't get far in my FDA because I figured I'd need to be able to save/load to make it through without taking all day. I do include a separate "bonk" demo where it feels like I'm hitting my head jumping off of a ledge, I don't know if you can do anything about that and it's not critical in any case. The sliding doors take some time after they close before you can use them again, which is also maybe an Eternity thing, but them doing massive damage if they close on you doesn't seem to be necessary and is a bit mean if someone gets caught between them, however unlikely that is in normal play. I like the swarm of new enemies (Grells IIRC?) at the end.

^{This song has always sounded so stupid to me, like industrial hillbilly music or something :p}

 

MAP07: Excellent map from pcorf, easier than the previous one but I appreciated the break. Quite fun. Not much else to say about it but that's because nothing needs changing.

 

MAP08: Nice map, music starts out a little cheesy but I liked it overall. The lift that takes you to the rocket launcher is a bit weird, I guess the revenant at the top can lower it? Change it to another action type like 120 or a generalized Boom lift if you want to stop this.

 

MAP09: Such a foreboding start, except the music is so cheery! The slime area at the start is very rough going without at least one of the sphere secrets, I lose 100 health in no time in my demo. The blue key area seemed a lot harder than the yellow key area at first, but once I knew not to turtle it was fine. I did completely run out of ammo for shooting the secret switches though -- given that they're already quite hard to find, putting a box of bullets in with the radsuits that open up when you can exit the level seems like a good idea to me. Loved the secret computer room.

 

SECRET02: I loved the concept of a jump-pad heavy map, but was disappointed both in how it was underused and having to strafe-jump across some areas. The rest of the map was still really fun though so I can't complain too much. You can walk through the spaceship "window" at the start which is probably unintentional, it's not game-breaking at least. The impassable linedefs with short barriers at the top level after taking a few lifts seemed weird, because the rest of the level is so dangerously open, but I guess you didn't want to obstruct the view at all with a texture. Good big fights with lots going on, without being overly tough.

edit: One monster closet didn't trigger because after hitting the switch I just went back the way I came instead of dropping down the ledge.

 

MAP10: The only level to really use the extra bestiary a bunch, I can't tell whether to say this makes it stand out or just stick out, but any blame for it feeling out of place should go to the other mappers who stuck with stock monsters really. The gameplay is very tame here, but the level was fun enough to explore anyhow, especially with all the 3D sectors. I liked the vent secret a lot (didn't find it in the demo) but from a "realism" point of view it needs some kind of fan or something to move air from elsewhere, right now it's just a vent to connect the air to different rooms. That's maybe nitpicking though. I got the blue armour secret from the vent but missed the remaining two.

 

MAP11: Loved the aesthetic here. It felt chaotic when I first played it because I didn't know how many things were firing at me (and because I kept picking up stuff to trigger more enemies :D) but it's really not. And even then there's lots of space to run around and dodge things. I was a bit frustrated at killing all the imp-turrets, but otherwise I really liked it. The switches to trigger the secrets are quite visible on the automap, but I think that's OK, I missed one in my first playthrough anyhow.

 

MAP12: [edit: I replayed it and had a much better time, see a few posts down for updated opinion. Leaving this comment here because some of it still applies, and provides context.]

Unfortunately this is the only map in the set that I didn't like, and it's a shame because the interconnected map layout and texturing are great. But the combat was either frustrating or just totally unengaging, and the At-Doom's-Gate-but-not music was quite grating for such a long map, and it made the whole thing feel like a chore. I might go back and play it again on an easier difficulty and with different music just to see how it fares there. The exception is the double-AV setup right near the end, and everything that came after that -- things really perked up there and it went out on a high note at least. It even made me appreciate the chainsaw that I got earlier in a secret, that I laughed at at the time!

The irradiated water doing 20% damage feels really unnecessary, especially without any kind of Danger/Radiation signage, as is hiding the radsuit for that secret with the armour bonuses around where you can't see it until you get to the other side of that window. If nothing else I think you should consider changing something about all of this.

Don't want to beat up on this map, I can appreciate a lot of work went into it, and again the visual side is great. But the gameplay just didn't do it for me.

 

MAP13: Great but extremely hard, no way I'm doing this without saves. Loved the visuals, especially the floating platforms and scrolling Geiger textures. A little surprised there are no custom monsters in here given that it's an Eternity map.

The use of 3D effects (portals I guess in EE-speak?) is excellent here and I commend you on making such good use of them, however a lot of weird fuckery resulted. Monsters being partly or totally invisible at times, the rocket launcher not being visible, seeing the back of my own head -- it all felt a little weird. I'm not sure how much of this is EE's fault, maybe there's nothing you can do about it.

On replaying it I got the secret-level switch and the BFG but I couldn't find the 3rd secret at all, even with a map editor. I'm also not sure if you can get those rockets behind the teleporter that can lead you to the BFG.

If you go into the exit room, leave, and come back, one of the wall lights turns red. I'm not sure what the significance of that is, if any, or why it's not red in the first place. There might be one and I'm just not catching it!

 

SECRET03: "This one's an absolute doozy." That's for sure! Not FDA friendly at all, but after beating it with saves I do go and record attempts until I get a successful exit, which is included. Very hectic but fun. A few bits that could be adjusted, maybe:

-Some of the medikits under the flesh are just a bit too far in to be picked up without difficulty.

-The indented switches in the black & red cyber room are annoying because, combined with the lack of visible walls, you really need to get the right angle to go and hit them. This is maybe intentional but I didn't like it. Also it seems like it's best to do that area pacifist, even though (I presume) the cybers come out for the next big fight if you don't kill them.

-It's too easy (by which I mean possible at all) to miss the rocket launcher and yellow key when you get thrust towards them.

-The switch in the fake exit room that's actually a teleporter feels a little janky because you don't teleport to exactly the same place, and there's no switch sound. Probably hard to fix though.

 

MAP14: One of these maps. Normally I find such safely-killable monster spam kind of tedious, but here I appreciated it as a breather from the previous maps. Curiosity eventually kills the cat in my demo though, as I take a teleporter from the safety of the basement right into the middle of the carnage. (I don't know why you *would* take those teleporters knowingly, under normal circumstances mind you, as the basement area is extremely unlikely to get flooded with monsters in such a way that the TPs are the safe way out.) One of the simpler maps in the wad but it was fine.

 

MAP15: Way more gentle than I was expecting from Roofi for a final-ish map, I did really like it though. Beware, the demo is 45 minutes long, though that includes going back to find the yellow key and the super-weapon secret it unlocks ;) In space, no one can hear you wonder aloud where the shotgun is! Playing with Eternity defaults you can walk over clusters of enemies below you, for which I was thankful. Fun!

 

MAP16: Nice end map. Secret level was the easiest to find from here.

 

SECRET04: Start is not as hard as it looks, at least with saves since you might eat a rocket. (I sure did!) The fight in the lava sure heats up though (sorry). It took me a number of tries but I got through it eventually. The switch for the secret fight was hard to find especially because of the shading on the wall there. It's also way above what I can handle difficulty wise so I just turned on godmode and blasted everything. Cacos can fly over other things by default in Eternity but that didn't seem to be a problem? I did wish I was playing with the deflated caco sprite edit I made, it was pretty hard to see anything with all of those dead tomatoes around, not that it mattered at that point. For the parts I could handle, I had fun, and it's perfectly reasonable to have such a hard challenge as a secret fight in a secret map.

Exiting this map takes you to MAP16 so you can loop back and forth between the two, but I guess there's no better way to do it short of making a 2nd endmap.

Edited September 27, 2023 by plums

[MObreck]

25 minutes ago, plums said:

I am curious why the custom monsters were Eternity format-only, since the wad as a whole only loads in Eternity and the monster resources were for MBF21. Oh well, far too late to change that.

 

The custom monsters should work in any source port that fully supports MBF21's dehacked extensions. The only things I altered from the standard MEDB resource pack was removing the unused monsters and the DECORATE support (makes them work in a few additional source ports that don't support MBF21) since the CP was slated to be Eternity only.

 

The only reason I can think of that the two maps with custom monsters are Eternity only is because they both use Eternity's UDMF format, mine in particular relying heavily on Eternity's unique portal system.

[plums]

@MObreck trying to load the wad in DSDA-Doom or Woof, gives this error and exits immediately.

Action (NULL) on state 1439 expects no more than 0 nonzero args (2 found). Check your dehacked.

I didn't try debugging this at all and just assumed there had to be some changes to the Dehacked to make it work in Eternity.

[MObreck]

10 minutes ago, plums said:

@MObreck trying to load the wad in DSDA-Doom or Woof, gives this error and exits immediately.

Action (NULL) on state 1439 expects no more than 0 nonzero args (2 found). Check your dehacked.

I didn't try debugging this at all and just assumed there had to be some changes to the Dehacked to make it work in Eternity.

 

Okay I see what I did wrong there. I was trying to change some flags for some of the flying monsters so they would sink into liquids after they died. Which is an Eternity only Dehacked code pointer. Strange the other source ports crash from that code pointer, being the happily ignore all the other Eternity unique settings I added to MEDB.

 

Ironically that code pointer serves no purpose, as Obsidian chose not to include the liquid physics I added for the project. But being the CP is Eternity only there isn't much point in fixing it either.

 

Thankfully the current official version of MEDB doesn't use those code pointers. I just tested it in DSDA-Doom and it worked without issue. Good to know not to add them at least :)

 

 

47 minutes ago, plums said:

MAP10: The only level to really use the extra bestiary a bunch, I can't tell whether to say this makes it stand out or just stick out, but any blame for it feeling out of place should go to the other mappers who stuck with stock monsters really. The gameplay is very tame here, but the level was fun enough to explore anyhow, especially with all the 3D sectors. I liked the vent secret a lot (didn't find it in the demo) but from a "realism" point of view it needs some kind of fan or something to move air from elsewhere, right now it's just a vent to connect the air to different rooms. That's maybe nitpicking though. I got the blue armour secret from the vent but missed the remaining two.

 

Glad you enjoyed it over all. I consider map building to be my weakest skill when it comes to DOOM modding. I'm still kind of stuck in the 90s when it comes to my map building techniques I guess :P. Still making this map was fun since I liked the theme of this CP and it gave me a chance to showcase a few MEDB monsters.

[plums]

17 minutes ago, MObreck said:

 

Okay I see what I did wrong there. I was trying to change some flags for some of the flying monsters so they would sink into liquids after they died. Which is an Eternity only Dehacked code pointer. Strange the other source ports crash from that code pointer, being the happily ignore all the other Eternity unique settings I added to MEDB.

 

Ironically that code pointer serves no purpose, as Obsidian chose not to include the liquid physics I added for the project. But being the CP is Eternity only there isn't much point in fixing it either.

You (or someone) definitely should fix them for this wad if that's the only thing keeping other ports from playing the non-Eternity levels; the fact that you could then record proper demos on those maps with DSDA-Doom/Woof/etc. is enough of a reason to alone.

 

17 minutes ago, MObreck said:

Glad you enjoyed it over all. I consider map building to be my weakest skill when it comes to DOOM modding. I'm still kind of stuck in the 90s when it comes to my map building techniques I guess :P. Still making this map was fun since I liked the theme of this CP and it gave me a chance to showcase a few MEDB monsters.

I think your map building was excellent, you were just too gentle on the player. Don't be afraid to offer up a challenge! It doesn't need to be a nightmarish assault, especially for a map like this were the focus is on exploration, just a bit more danger once in a while to keep people engaged.

[MObreck]

24 minutes ago, plums said:

You (or someone) definitely should fix them for this wad if that's the only thing keeping other ports from playing the non-Eternity levels; the fact that you could then record proper demos on those maps with DSDA-Doom/Woof/etc. is enough of a reason to alone.

 

I think your map building was excellent, you were just too gentle on the player. Don't be afraid to offer up a challenge! It doesn't need to be a nightmarish assault, especially for a map like this were the focus is on exploration, just a bit more danger once in a while to keep people engaged.

 

Ok, I'll fix it tommorrow. Should be easy enough.

 

Thanks for compliments.

[plums]

One more thing, the fireball explosion sound for the mini-caco like creatures (only shown on MAP10 IIRC) has some nasty clipping that sounds very bad to me, here's a cleaned-up version of that sound if you want it. (Feel free to use it in the MBF21 monster pack or wherever as well if you like it.)

 

https://user.fm/files/v2-d5d66b583855739f221f6939dadb813a/DSFRE037_cleanup.wav

[plums]

OK I replayed MAP12, still on UV, and had a much more enjoyable time with it, to the point where I would rank it at least in the top half of maps of the wad based on how much I liked them. Here's what made the most difference, roughly in order of impact:

 

Using a different music track. Oh my god did this change the feel of the map. The chosen MIDI that's literally riffing on At Doom's Gate is clever, and would be great for a punchy 5-10 minute combat-heavy map, but in this it just goes on and on and on and ughh! I tried out a few tracks from the wad before settling on the music from MAP02 and it was infinitely more pleasant.

 

Not using Eternity. I can't say this experience with Eternity won me over to it at all. It was tolerable but I was never glad to be using it. How much it affected my experience varied by map; for whatever reason I really found myself frustrated with some aspects of it while I played MAP12 the first time. After fixing the Dehacked errors, going back to a port that I like better, like Woof, removed a bunch of frustration. This one's completely not your fault. (Though one thing that Woof does, that Eternity doesn't, is preserve music changes with IDMUS when you save your game...)

 

Knowing about the damaging water. Yeah I really think you need a sign up somewhere.

 

I still think there's a bit too much simplistic forward-facing combat, and the Spiderdemon is mostly an ammo tax, but without the frustrations above detracting from my baseline enjoyment already these things became just minor annoyances that I could more or less ignore, and appreciate all the good things about the map's visual and exploration-focused design.

 

It's probably too late and not worth it for a major overhaul, especially since Obsidian wants to release this soon, but here are a few things I think you should change:

 

* Either lower the water damage to 10%, or put up some warning signs. Also consider putting a window to the radsuit closet in the secret with the armour bonuses.

 

* Revisiting this area, my shots were blocked in that doorway until I walked into it, probably blocked because the sector for the fake bridge above hadn't lowered yet.

 

* This revenant ambush was a nice sudden challenge, but it was frustrating having no health items at all after until you clear out most of the next room full of hitscanners, across a bridge where you can be shot at by arachnotrons. And that was going in there with extra health and armour, and having killed a bunch of the hitscanners already from the previously-mentioned armour bonus secret! Someone unprepared could absolutely get wrecked here, and it's such a spike in difficulty compared to the map up until that point. I'd put at least a medikit or two in this room.

 

* Consider a different MIDI. I don't know how tied you are to this track. I can be picky about music sometimes so other people are welcome to chime in with a second opinion; I can accept that it's just me if no one else seems bothered by it.

[Obsidian]

6 minutes ago, plums said:

* Consider a different MIDI.

 

Oh yeah, Fletcher` used a MIDI mash-up of At Doom's Gate and Megalovania, didn't they? I'd have put that map in a secret slot for that MIDI usage alone if I was able, haha.

[plums]

6 minutes ago, Obsidian said:

MIDI mash-up of At Doom's Gate and Megalovania

Ah, that's what that is. (Haven't played Undertale before, listening to Megalovania now.) It's a clever idea, but not one I want to listen to for half an hour.

[Redead-ITA]

I updated My map given the feedback of plums on it,

I decided to change the switch to the elevator so that it made more sense gameplay wise. 

May2023red.zip

[MObreck]

Here is a fix for the Dehacked lump. It removes the unused code pointers that crash other source ports. Plums's tweaked version of the DSFRE037 sound effect is also included:

 

MAYhem2023_DehackedFix.zip

[Obsidian]

Paging @Fletcher` so they can see the map feedback.

[Roofi]

On 9/26/2023 at 10:04 PM, plums said:

 

 

MAP15: Way more gentle than I was expecting from Roofi for a final-ish map, I did really like it though. Beware, the demo is 45 minutes long, though that includes going back to find the yellow key and the super-weapon secret it unlocks ;) In space, no one can hear you wonder aloud where the shotgun is! Playing with Eternity defaults you can walk over clusters of enemies below you, for which I was thankful. Fun!

 

 

Thanks for playing ! Actually I didn't design this map as a final but the length and the heroic midi could explain Obsidian's choice to place this map in final slot. :)

 

And frankly, I like it this way: a final map doesn't necessarily have to be excruciatingly difficult to provide good sensations.