Doom 3 Old Monster Design

Doomguy777 said:

And when you say DOOM 64 Pain Elemental you mean DOOM PC Cacodemon.

You do realize that the Doom 64 Pain Elemental has two mouths, it is not really round and it has these bony things behind its sides, so why would you treat it the same as the original cacodemon regardless of the differences?

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The re-designs weren't that bad...I mean, Pinky looks amazing, Imps too and some people will like the re-disign of the Hell knight...

Personally, I like the remodeled monsters, but some should be more "classic" like de Cacodemon.

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GoatLord said:

I wonder why id skimped on the demonic details. Maybe they thought it was cheesy to go for a "satanic" look.

Personally, I'm glad they skipped out on the demonic-goat look.

It's not hard to have demonic or satanic things without going with the stereotypical/cliche'd use of inverted pentagrams and goats.

Anyways, other than the aforementioned aspect that DOOM I/II and DOOM 3 hold different mentalities (shoot 'em up vs horror survival), having demons go a route different than "add spikes, horns, or goat-features will make them demonic" was nice to see.

Foes like the imp and hell knight got improvements. The pinky and cacodemons felt more like new monsters than redesigns (even if the means of attack was the same) - for the pinky demon it was more of going from big and muscular to fat and blubbery while the cacodemon looked more like it was the decapitated head of cyberdemons-minus-the-cyber-and-horns, but other than those two (iffy on the cyberdemon itself), I felt that the looks for the demons were rather well done for the change in game atmosphere.

Rambosee said:

I thought they were scary.
Nothing scared the shit out of me as much as opening a door to a Hell Knight.

I think that's more of the thriller aspect of the game rather than the design of the monster.

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Konig Varorson said:

The pinky and cacodemons felt more like new monsters than redesigns

The Doom 64 cacodemon looks more like a recycled Doom 2 pain elemental than a new monster.

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Avoozl said:

The Doom 64 cacodemon looks more like a recycled Doom 2 pain elemental than a new monster.


Yep. That's right. I didn't like the monsters disigns in DOOM 64...
I prefer the Doom 3 versions rather. They're more scary and bad-a**

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I guess excessive visual homology, repetition and lack of variety can be excused enough to be scary due the better graphics.

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J-selva said:

I guess excessive visual homology, repetition and lack of variety can be excused enough to be scary due the better graphics.


Not necesarelly...

DOOM 3 was scary because it looked so different than the originals DOOM's.

It was a dark-horror game instead of an action game like the first two.

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As mentioned, some Doom 3 characters are almost the same as the originals. I quite like the new Hell Knight although he needs to be more demonic. Didn't like the new imp (probably due to his personality rather than his looks!).

Just some points to put out there:

Adrian Carmack left id in 2005. Doom 3 released in 2004. Adrian and Kenneth Scott both had input in Doom 3, right?

Don't forget co-owner Kevin Cloud! He's been an artist at id since Wolfenstein 3D. Since Adrian's departure, he's now lead artist.

It's not just these guys that have creative input to character / monster design. For example, Sandy Petersen stated he had 'quite a lot' of input on monster design (although perhaps this is more Quake based than Doom). I'm guesing Doom's monsters were in place when Sandy joined id, although he could well have had input with Doom II's monsters.

I'm wondering now if they will re-use some of Doom 3's monster models for Doom 4...

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I think some of the Doom 3 monsters were okay. The Imp was bland though and the Cacodemon was just Duke3D's Octabrain. I think a decent 3D modder could make proper updates of classic Doom monsters. Id already sort of did with the Forgotten Ones being actual Lost Souls. The Imp... add spikes and redo the face with two big eyes. The Revenant wouldn't need much work, just remove the clear skin and give it new body armor, it's already fairly close. The Arch-Vile, remove the beating hearts form the hands.

Pinky Demons might be hardest, but it could be done if you go by the Doom 64 versions. The Baron/Hellknight and Cyberdemon would also require new models, as would the Cacodemon.

I wouldn't consider those JDoom 3D models as an example. Those are simple and probably long outdated. I know they're probably pushing a decade old, if not more.

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I was very disappointed with the new Cacodemon. He looks like a turd, and moves like a brainless blind balloon, always bumps into railings or other Cacodemons, even tho he has like 3000 eyes. I think that it would be much better if he was bigger and slower, more grand. I also think that Trites and Ticks are almost worthless. Every other monster is pretty cool and i especially like how there is large quantity of different zombies in the game.

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I though the trites and ticks looked awesome, though I've never truly gotten through doom 3, always got bored as it wasn't that fun for me

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Surely I can't be the only who thought the re-imagining of the Pinkies in Doom 3 was pretty cool...

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schwerpunk said:

Surely I can't be the only who thought the re-imagining of the Pinkies in Doom 3 was pretty cool...

You're not. I actually liked the design even more than the original.

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The only redesigns I never really liked were the Cacodemons and lost souls. The old Cacodemons were kind of huge and imposing, but the new ones are shrunken and look a little like demonic balloons. And if they could replace all the lost souls with the classic-styled ones from Resurrection of Evil, I wouldn't mind. I think the Revenant would have been creepier if it didn't have transparent skin and was just held together with some stringy muscles or something. My last gripe is that not enough demons have hooves, horns, or spikes sticking out of them (like the original imp). Those features seem to be reserved to the Cyberdemon and Guardian. I think that if Id could have taken the new Hell Knight, made his skin kind of pinkish, and slapped on some horns to add a Baron of Hell to the Doom 3 roster that would have been awesome.

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