Mapping Etiquette (Flicker Lights)

[Wo0p]

Hello forums :)

 

Merry Christmas or whatever else you may be celebrating around this time of year in your area :)

 

Anyway, to the point!

I've been thinking a while on the use of the Flicker Light dynamic Thing, both spotlight and regular. I really love using them to create spoopy atmosphere or as visual guides for players to help them navigate my maps. However, it occurred to me that they may be seizure inducing, and in the spirit of inclusivity and because I don't want to be a dick to epileptics: Are there any commonly established frequency in the mapping community that ought to be considered... safe, or very unlikely to induce seizures? I've recently been trying to use a Rotation on the Flicker Light Thing of 340 which results in a few blips per second with a second's pause inbetween every now and then. This seemed to ME, a non-epileptic, to be a very mild flickering effect, but I've no idea.

Does frequency even matter or is it actually the pattern of flashing that induces seizures and this whole conundrum is outside a mapper's ability to curtail?

 

Thanks for any replies and your time :)

[Walter confetti]

Mh... Nobody really cared in all these years of Doom mapping, at least from what i've played. BTW, it's a kind of rare thing a map with heavy usage of flickering lights, the first that comes in my mind is Nightmares of Loki

[Jayextee]

As a general rule, avoid anything with fullscreen flickering if you can; which I'd say means to use flickering lights sparingly and in small areas -- not entire swathes of open space, if you can help it.

But from what I understand, you can never absolutely 100% guarantee that something in a videogame is completely safe for epileptics. Thus, 'use sparingly' is going to be to your own better judgement, really. "No flickering" is the best possible outcome, but whether or not that's to your map's detriment is going to be entirely your call.

[Matt Eldrydge]

I think it's fine so long as you don't make it flicker the way that one map Xaser made for 50 Shades of Graytall. That one does warrant an epilepsy warning but it is a rad as hell effect for Boom.

 

The standard light blink random and light flicker sector specials are fine. I know a couple people who have epilepsy and occasionally play Doom or see my maps in motion, none of them ever reported any issues so far.

 

If anything, I'd avoid the light blink fast/slow special for large spaces or in multiple sectors close together. That one's effect seems more likely to cause issues IMO.

[Wo0p]

Thanks for all your replies, I'll take your input to heart when making maps. :) I really appreciate it, especially since I don't have epileptic friends to test on  help guide me ^_^

[ViolentBeetle]

Whatever you do, don't have light oscilate in the entire room. Having it on background is fine, but constant swings will burn people's retinas, they won't even need epilepsy for this.

[E.M.]

I use flickering lights to mark secrets or locations where monsters will pop out. The effect is fine for small things like that. What I don't like is a long sequence of flickering lights. Old wads were really bad when it came to that. The worst example of this would have to be "Time Gate" from Eternal Doom. If you've ever played that wad, then you'll know.

[prfunky]

8 hours ago, E.M. said:

I use flickering lights to mark secrets or locations where monsters will pop out. The effect is fine for small things like that. What I don't like is a long sequence of flickering lights. Old wads were really bad when it came to that. The worst example of this would have to be "Time Gate" from Eternal Doom. If you've ever played that wad, then you'll know.

 

I was gonna say!

Yep; Time Gate. But it's so AWESOME map!!

I would say if you have worry about epilepsy trigger in video game,

stay away from 8-bit deathmatch as well...

 

[Wo0p]

14 hours ago, ViolentBeetle said:

Whatever you do, don't have light oscilate in the entire room. Having it on background is fine, but constant swings will burn people's retinas, they won't even need epilepsy for this.

 

Dang, really? I definitely wouldn't have thought of this. Thanks for bringing attention to it! :)

 

13 hours ago, E.M. said:

I use flickering lights to mark secrets or locations where monsters will pop out. The effect is fine for small things like that. What I don't like is a long sequence of flickering lights. Old wads were really bad when it came to that. The worst example of this would have to be "Time Gate" from Eternal Doom. If you've ever played that wad, then you'll know.

 

I haven't played Time Gate but that's a good use of flickering lights! Like an early warning and an attention grabber :)

[Red Recluse]

Places of cliffs, abysses and rise filled large arachnotrons absence medikit stimpack but four health bonus also life amplification goggles.

[Peccatum Mihzamiz]

I was actually asked (told actually, but whatever) to change a map of mine to blink less frequently. In the end I was not able to that on that project but it stuck with me.

I am currently working on my own map set and am seriously considering making a separate version later on that just removes a whole bunch of the lights, because I do go ham in that set. I already had one person not being able to playtest it because of sensitivity. It'll probably be a question of simply removing several linedef and sector light functions, to make it all quite a bit more restrained. I'll see what it smartest with that: probably will just include it in the zip file as an extra wad file.

[Dragonfly]

We had to amend Eviternity II MAP06 to use much less flickering. Despite it being a big part of the ma's "mood", locking some players out from fears of having a seisure just isn't right. I've learned from this that generally speaking, if you're gonna use flickering lights it's best to try to have it flicker/pulse a slower speed, lower intensity, or in a smaller space.

[Wo0p]

9 hours ago, Peccatum Mihzamiz said:

I was actually asked (told actually, but whatever) to change a map of mine to blink less frequently. In the end I was not able to that on that project but it stuck with me.

I am currently working on my own map set and am seriously considering making a separate version later on that just removes a whole bunch of the lights, because I do go ham in that set. I already had one person not being able to playtest it because of sensitivity. It'll probably be a question of simply removing several linedef and sector light functions, to make it all quite a bit more restrained. I'll see what it smartest with that: probably will just include it in the zip file as an extra wad file.

 

Any type of media that provides several options for how to consume it is a wonderful thing. I think you're on the right track, adding several versions, even if it requires more work. :)

 

9 hours ago, Dragonfly said:

We had to amend Eviternity II MAP06 to use much less flickering. Despite it being a big part of the ma's "mood", locking some players out from fears of having a seisure just isn't right. I've learned from this that generally speaking, if you're gonna use flickering lights it's best to try to have it flicker/pulse a slower speed, lower intensity, or in a smaller space.

 

Thanks for the insight :)

And I think it's an amicable approach to design; trying to include as many people as possible without sacrificing the vision in the process. Although sometimes you just have to trumph through your vision in my opinion despite your concerns. That's what a disclaimer warning is for, but you should aim for inclusivity from the beginning. That's how I try to design stuff at least, but I still have much to learn. (Using "you" here as a general term, not pointing at anyone) :)

[Shepardus]

I could have sworn there was a source port or a mod with options to mitigate the flickering light specials, but I can't find it now (maybe I'm confusing it with Woof's level brightness setting?). Might be a good idea for someone to implement if it doesn't already exist.

[Fletcher`]

Just fuck up my eyes, fam