TAS (tools-assisted) demos

I think it looks pretty good.

MD922: best description which i ever see (txt) + again DLC XD
Also under 'TAS HUD' i meant hud with info about time and speed of slow-mo.
That HUD is very useful for Runner but useless for simple watcher.
I would like more default HUD but whatever.

vdgg said:

I didn't really plan to do it, wanted to beat it non-assisted first... am I too lazy?

I guess laziness is something different. Under laziness i meant realizing DLC and forget it, not about doing demo from 1 week to 1 one year.
For me spent so much time on TAS Demo (more than 1-4 days) is worthless and senselessly.

MD922 said:

Here is my Zone 300 TAS so far. I tried using turn tics in XDRE2 that are not over 10 so it looks a bit smoother when played back with PrBoom+. Tell me if you want to see this kind of turning in my future runs.

I'd like to see the lift wait much shorter on the way back from the blue key on map 2, but looks alright otherwise.

What do you mean my shorter? I have no idea how to make that lift lower earlier.

EDIT: I know what you mean now Kraflab. Have a monster bring it down. Well, can't redo it without dysync, so sadly can't change that

MD922 said:

What do you mean my shorter? I have no idea how to make that lift lower earlier.

EDIT: I know what you mean now Kraflab. Have a monster bring it down. Well, can't redo it without dysync, so sadly can't change that

Of course you can change it. You could start from scratch if you wanted, you're only a few maps in :P

Or just roll the RNG number back to the same as when you exit the level (by shooting air, by waiting couple frames before exiting level etc).

I will see if I can roll it back, but most likely I'll lose too much time or can't get the right RNG roll in the nick of time.

Azuruish said:

For me spent so much time on TAS Demo (more than 1-4 days) is worthless and senselessly.

Pretty disappointing... With these politics you'll never become a good TASer.

Akse said:

Pretty disappointing... With these politics you'll never become a good TASer.

I don't get it.
Good taser measured by how long he is working with demo or how quick demo and smoothed it is?
Strange logic: If i can make 'TNT' in 30:01 'which is record for now' in one day it mean I'm bad Taser
but if when i spent on 'Sunder' two weeks - I'm good taser even there are no one glide and poor optimization (because of complevel).

Azuruish said:

Good taser measured by how long he is working with demo or how quick demo and smoothed it is?

By how much effort he puts in it. Your motto is quantity over quality.

Good TASer=Good Optimization. You should be taking advice from all TAS runners that have more demos/have more quality demos then you. You shouldn't be trying to prove the better runner wrong, and improve on what they recommend. The points is it that you seem to act as if getting a TAS record is too easy ex: TNT run in 30:01 you made, done within several days, beats a run an older run that was spent a lot of time on and used the tools they had at that time to the near best.

EDIT: or, ignore this and read Akse's post again. ^

Azuruish said:

I don't get it.

A good TASer listens to people. You don't. When somebody says there's better runs out there, you should improve yours, your typical response: "Nah, whatever." Let's take your MM2 movie as an example. When i said Clumsy did the first maps faster you should've stop your current progress and redo it from scratch. I also said that you missed an obvious jump in m22. My remark has been ignored completely.

Akse said:

By how much effort he puts in it. Your motto is quantity over quality.

What if i prefer it more? Bad TASer? (0//0) With whom do you compare me? with yourself? with Looper or 4shockblast?
I guess you never compared me with a worst TASer which don't even care about optimization. They just love 'Slow-mo'...
I don't know what a jump in Map22. There are cage everywhere + 'redo it from scratch' = Insane...
I will never redo MM2. I'm not enjoyed by that wad. Better redo 'Sunder' in this case.
But don't think that I'm ignoring all yours advices otherwise my TNT could be still 32:31.

Azuruish said:

Good taser measured by how long he is working with demo or how quick demo and smoothed it is?

This conversation has happened before. A top quality TAS takes a LONG time to make, especially if it's a 30 map one. What people are trying to tell you is that if you slowed down and focused more on trying to optimise your runs as you go, you would end up with a much better product, and the process of optimising would get quicker for you.

What is probably frustrating people like Aske and MD922 is that you are not listening to their advice and are being confrontational. It's certainly annoying me and I'm only a spectator, not a TAS maker.

Maybe you're not aiming for top quality, and that's fine, but you have to be willing to take the fact people will criticise things. The fact you can redo things as many times as you like means you don't really have a valid counter argument. Your only argument seems to be that it would take more time.

Welcome to TAS. Things take time.

This is why this thread is dead. Azuruish is screwing off everybody, and this thread is ruined. Used to be a thread of amazing creations but over during these monthes this thread turned into a lump of garbage; a place of arguments full of disrespect to the max by now. I wish the last few pages of this thread could be helled.

Also, you won't have to credit the entire Doomworld speedrunning elite. :D
It's always good to work in teams, but you have to become more independent.

degree23 said:

This conversation has happened before.

Exactly! Yet we're here again.

degree23 said:

It's certainly annoying me and I'm only a spectator, not a TAS maker.

See?

Azuruish said:

Bad TASer?

A lazy one that's for sure.

Azuruish said:

With whom do you compare me? with yourself? with Looper or 4shockblast?

Heretic's 30mm2707 for example.

Azuruish said:

I don't know what a jump in Map22.

That jump.

m22jump.zip

Hey Azuruish, since you clearly dont want to become a good TASer by most other people's standards and have your own goals, i'm curious - what are your own goals in TASing? Because right now i can't even imagine what you're trying to do. Not trying to judge you though, it's your choice what you want to do with your time :)

There's one relatively offtopic fact: Make one very good TAS movie, and you'll be able to make quite good tases extremely fast. There's not much skill needed in producing high quality tases in doom (but there's a LOT of skill required to make Looper-like tases though), it's an easy and straightforward task, you just have to struggle through it once or twice and you're done. After that you will learn a lot about efficient TASing and optimization and will become much faster at producing new runs, with an added benefit of them all being higher quality. But if you choose to take babysteps (like you're doing right now), you'll lose out in a long run, even if your goal is quantity over quality.

The whole quantity over quality paradigm doesn't really fit tools-assisted speedrunning though, usually their whole idea is about pushing the limits far beyond human abilities, instead of barely beyond human abilities.

M02 redone for Zone 300, 2 seconds saved! Sadly, coulnd't get the RNG rolled back to 190 from my z301-04, so I'll be redoing those maps sometime soon. If anyone can manage the RNG change, good luck because I got a .97, making it a lot harder.

z301-02x050.zip

I had asked for help only for MM2 because on Windows 8 are crashing XDRE.
Woo wow wow... I'm ruined that thread... Ruined.
I'm releasing D2ALL: Ruined?
I'm released Doom2 NM 100: Ruined? You guys (not all, several) such a pessimists.
'Never_again' said to me: keep doing it and i will. (NM100 must be redo)
Others said i just screwing awesome thread. Pheww////
Akse: and what? could saved 5-7 secs there. And? here is difference from bad taser to good taser?
If i something missed it means I'm bad TASer? Damn... Just walking around.
Jongo: Answer on your question:
For example i want watch 'Doom 2 Reload' wad but there wasn't D2ALL.
So, I'm doing D2ALL and appraise wad, cool it or not (appraise design, style, difficulty) and collect it for ideas.
I really enjoyed by that WAD and someday I'll released UV-MAX on it. Also Deus Vaul with Valiant has a best design which i ever saw. Sunder, WOS, New Gothic. It's so sweet and because of sweet i'm doing D2ALL.
I want to do almost on all Megawad just to see how that wad looks like and try to play it or leave it. You decide of course, my opinion I'm describing in TXT.
I'm not following super time (not everywhere and all time) and I'm against (built style because of smoothless, but cool for instant glide, noth to say)
it's not even beautiful when Runner shot to nowhere and killing someone (yeah i'm doing it when fooling around or where have to but not all time), I'm following for... ammm... excursions i guess. Just to show how good WAD looks.
In UV-MAX on Doom2 of course I'm doing for time. Pseudo Tyson on MAP23 i did because noone tried to do such insane trick and i thought and could be cool.
I see why so many discontented. When I'm releasing something: first they are comparing time and if i late somewhere in 2-10 secs, they will blame me and say that i'm worse of the worse. But here other story where i won't take a part.
You also can ask: why do you use TAS for it? Maybe because without TAS i can't play XD

Azuruish, go read the first few pages of this thread. Then compare it to the last 5 pages of the thread. There is an obvious difference.

You can keep doing TASes of wads you like, just do them better! Spend more time optimizing, be more patient (which is why I just can't TAS because I have almost no patience) and everything will be fine. "Smoothness" really should not be your main focal point. You should focus on getting through as fast as inhumanly possible.

Azuruish said:

here is difference from bad taser to good taser?

Yes. You should use every opportunity. Вместо этого ты делаешь на отъебись.

Azuruish said:

and what? could saved 5-7 secs there. And?

I get it. You simply don't give a shit.
Edit:

Azuruish said:

Maybe because without TAS i can't play XD

This explains everything.

By now, I'm getting really ticked off of your disrespect towards other's opinion. Like Akse's said, take every opportunity in a run to speed it up. Doesn't need to look really fancy, but fast.

Don't give a shit?
I just don't want rerun it not because 'i don't give a shit' but because i have no any wishes do it. 11 hours spending on saving a little time instead create new D2ALL not worth it for me.
You (Akse) have cooler skill than me and can easily to beat my time, but instead you blaming me.

This is why TAS runs are done over long periods of time, not straining yourself to do a run in 11 hours ._.

Azuruish said:

but instead you blaming me.

I'm not blame you. I want you to put some effort in your movies and don't act like a child. Be professional.

It's shameful when a bunch of lame demos get more attention than actually watchable stuff. Get a grip.

3ha2 d2all in 17:06

3ha2tas.zip

=========================================
Killing Adventure D2All UV-Speed in 13:36
=========================================
Next step: Vile Flesh or Alien Vendetta.
JCD: Cool TAS... jerky but whatever. I noticed something. In MAP31 You killed revenants by Plasmagun.
I guess with rocketlauncher it could be a lot faster besides until 'death exit' you had 9 rockets. You could spent all these rockets on revenants and leave one for 'death exit'.

killadve_uv-speed.zip