Doom/ Doom 2 pop quiz!

StupidBunny said:
That's actually a really good idea except that the question says it's a level in Doom II. The one you refer to is in Doom.

That's where I got the idea, but I thought it might be possible that they re-used it to reach a secret area in a Doom II level that I wasn't aware of or have forgotten.

myk said:
You don't need to attack to get them, as you can lure the monsters out.

In addition, acquiring the chainsaw doesn't reveal any secrets. So much for that idea...

1. Cyberdemon, Archvile, Spider Mastermind, Pain Elemental (with out Crusher Glitch), Lost Soul (With out Crusher Glitch), Icon of Sin, that makes 6.

2. Unsure.

3. I would say you would have 4-6 left as a normal shotgun takes 2-3 pumps to kill a Specter/Demon, so you could kill all if lucky, but 3-4 should be left.

4. Unsure, never had book.

5. Map 30, Icon of Sin, use Rocket Launcher, no other weapon (Statistically saying) has a spalsh radius other then BFG but target has to be in view.

6. Cells, as they do more damage (Plasma Rifle, single bursts), and Bullets do little but be little stun shots to weak demons.

7. From what I remember, I played that map alot, starting from beginning theres Zombiemen to 2 demons, so in the Star is 6 specters.

8. Baron/Knight and Revenant with the barrel glitch, but I don't know how to activate it but I know i've seen it on accident.

9. Lost Soul, non hitscan but hates anything.

10. Unsure.

11. Unsure, I find Doom 2's final level quite symmetrical..

12. It's the Warrens, but reason is unsure, maybe cause it has lots of openings like the teleporter trap with the Cyb.

GreyGhost said:

Is the answer to question 10 -

Spoiler

The SSG in "Suburbs"?

Lady's and gentlemen we have ourselves a winner.

That's not the intended way to get to that secret. If you do it the "proper" way, you can use any hitscan weapon. You can also use any hitscan weapon to hit it while dropping from or rising on the other platform.

exp(x) said:

That's not the intended way to get to that secret. If you do it the "proper" way, you can use any hitscan weapon. You can also use any hitscan weapon to hit it while dropping from or rising on the other platform.

are we thinking of the same secret?

I also figured that you were thinking of the SSG in suburbs. But, as far as I can remember, there are enough moving parts in that room that you can reach the right height to hit the targets without the SSG.

If you're referring to either the secret with the 2 boxes of shells and the backpack, or the secret with the megasphere, then you're wrong. Neither require a SSG.

Both have lifts nearby that bring you up to the proper level; there is a secret switch on a nearby firestick that will lift the ceiling up so you can use the lift to shoot at the switch that will give you access to the backpack room.

myk said:

I doubt this, unless you're playing an early version of the game (like v1.2), before the behavior of demons and spectres was modified.

Yup, I remember the "official" Doom FAQ 6.666 quoting this, and also saw it happenning a lot when I played with Doom v1.1 (yeah, I was stuck with that for a long time).

Hellbent said:

are we thinking of the same secret?

This one?

1. Lost soul, pain elemental, archvile, spider mastermind, cyberdemon
2. 50%
3. 5 left up
4. Dunno cos I havent read the guide...I'll say "all it's missiles are homing"
5. Map 30
6. Two bullet boxes, unless you're facing a spider with a BFG
7. 10
8. If they blow up a barrel near another of their kind
9. Lost soul
10. Map 16
11. E4M8
12. Warrens, cos of the underground tunnels with the shotgun guys at the end

Nuxius said:

If you're referring to either the secret with the 2 boxes of shells and the backpack, or the secret with the megasphere, then you're wrong. Neither require a SSG.

Both have lifts nearby that bring you up to the proper level; there is a secret switch on a nearby firestick that will lift the ceiling up so you can use the lift to shoot at the switch that will give you access to the backpack room.

Exactly. The pistol is perfectly able to open both secrets, when you do it as intended.

Mithral_Demon said:

1. Cyberdemon, Archvile, Spider Mastermind, Pain Elemental (with out Crusher Glitch), Lost Soul (With out Crusher Glitch), Icon of Sin, that makes 6.

The Lost Soul doesn't have raise frames. So no, they can't be raised even with the crush glitch.

Gez said:

Exactly. The pistol is perfectly able to open both secrets, when you do it as intended.

Indeed. It's even easier this way instead of using the spread of the SSG.

Yeah, while I've often opened the shell box secret with the SSG I just opened it with the pistol by hopping off the platform and shooting at the right moment (on the first try).

Some people have been mentioning the final boss ("Icon of sin") as one of the monsters that can't be raised by an arch-vile, but it's not a monster. It's just a thing that forms part of the top boss enemy. As far as I'm concerned the Commander Keen is, though, because it behaves like one in various ways and is affected by the no monsters argument. It even counts toward kills.

myk said:

I doubt this, unless you're playing an early version of the game (like v1.2), before the behavior of demons and spectres was modified.

Maes said:

Yup, I remember the "official" Doom FAQ 6.666 quoting this, and also saw it happenning a lot when I played with Doom v1.1 (yeah, I was stuck with that for a long time).

Here's the kicker - it's been written in every manual in every official port since 1.0 that bull demons can attack each other. one port even made it very easy to pull it off (thinking it's the GBA doom2).

1. Archvile, Cyberdemon, Spider Mastermind, Romero head
2. 16.66%
3. On average 16, assuming no other weapons are used
4. They fire twin missiles? I have no idea at all.
5. MAP30, Rocket Launcher
6. I would say 2 enegry cells because that's enough cells for a BFG shot which could potentially one shot a spider mastermind where as the 2 boxes of bullets could only half a spider masterminds health and that's assuming all bullets do their max damage
7. I'll go with the crowd and say 10
8. Monster 1 detonates barrel, splash hits monster 2, fight breaks out
9. Lost soul
10. None
11. E4M8, Unto the cruel
12. Warrens, can't be arsed researching why.

1. The Archvile cannot revive lost souls, masterminds, cyberdemons, or other archviles.

2. I really don't know. 0%?

3. None. 50 shells without backpack, 2 shells per shot, 1 shot = 1 dead spectre.

4. I guess not every monster that dies becomes a revenant, seriously how does a caco become a revenant when it dies.

5. Icon of Sin. Rocket Launcher required.

6. Assuming we can use the BFG, this gives enough damage to one shot a baron with the use of one cell, having another left over. Using bullets (and perfect accuracy), both boxes would be used.

7. I believe its 2 per corner so 10.

8. One hits a barrel and the other goes in to kill the other. Most popular example: Phobos Anomaly Barons in the barrel corner.

9. Lost Soul

10. I think its Suburbs, M16. In that Brown building with the fireplace thingy.

11. Unto the Cruel, E4M8

12. Warrens. Not really sure why it's called this but I am assuming because it is a bit mazy/tunnlish.

Gez said:

Exactly. The pistol is perfectly able to open both secrets, when you do it as intended.


The Lost Soul doesn't have raise frames. So no, they can't be raised even with the crush glitch.

Ummm... yeah, I never knew about that little lift. Well don't I feel sheepish....

As for question 4, the DOOM II manual says: Apparently when a demon dies, they pick him up, dust him off, wire him some combat gear, and send him back into battle. No rest for the wicked, eh?

It's saying the revenants have been reanimated from the remains of dead demons, not that they animate other monsters. Unless the strategy guide says it differently, in which case there may be a mistake there.

The description of the monster is a reference to the meaning of "revenant", which means something like "returner" or "he who returns" in French. It's a name used for ghosts and the like.

myk said:

As for question 4, the DOOM II manual says: Apparently when a demon dies, they pick him up, dust him off, wire him some combat gear, and send him back into battle. No rest for the wicked, eh?

It's saying the revenants have been reanimated from the remains of dead demons, not that they animate other monsters. Unless the strategy guide says it differently, in which case there may be a mistake there.

The description of the monster is a reference to the meaning of "revenant", which means something like "returner" or "he who returns" in French. It's a name used for ghosts and the like.

This is correct, I just checked my Doom 2 manuel as well.

However, the manuel makes this statement without being specific about what kinds of monsters become revenants. Ofcourse givin the nitty gritty additude the manuel has, it might not be 100% for certain this is how revenants are exactly formed either.

Also Myk pretty much summed up what a revenant is. Usually a spirit which returns from the dead.

myk said:

It's saying the revenants have been reanimated from the remains of dead demons, not that they animate other monsters. Unless the strategy guide says it differently, in which case there may be a mistake there.

The strategy guide doesn't really say anything about its creation. This is the full quote from its description of the Revenant: "A rocket-launching skeleton with a mean right hook when he is up close and personal. From a distance, he fires slow guided projectiles that are easy to outrun, but always hit on target." Again, I'd assert that the only real error is the implication that all of its missiles have a homing effect.

the Revenant is prolly made up of multiple demon remains. his shape and size isn't similiar enough to any other demon (cept for Vile but there arent enough of them to make up for all the revenants) to be the remains of just one type.

and btw sence where on the topic of secrets, or at least this was a secret to me, can someone please tell me sence when is there a Spider Mastermind on level 12. i was playing coop with my bro earlier today and i have never seen that there before. im assuming hes one of those only entcounter on multiplayer monsters. like the cyberdemon on level 11. are there alot of those?

For question 3, wouldn't the number of remaining specters vary?

Try this.

RE: Question 10

myk said:

As for question 4, the DOOM II manual says: Apparently when a demon dies, they pick him up, dust him off, wire him some combat gear, and send him back into battle. No rest for the wicked, eh?

It's saying the revenants have been reanimated from the remains of dead demons, not that they animate other monsters. Unless the strategy guide says it differently, in which case there may be a mistake there.

The description of the monster is a reference to the meaning of "revenant", which means something like "returner" or "he who returns" in French. It's a name used for ghosts and the like.

Sorry guys, I guess my memory didn't serve.... I must have read that from the game manual and for some reason thought it was from the strategy guide. And I guess I misunderstood the quote. Thanks for clearing that up Myk. But to me the quote still seems like it's saying "Revenants pick up dead demons, dust them off, wire them some combat gear, and them back into battle...." Whose picking up the revenants and wiring them with new combat gear? The demons that die??? I'm still not clear on this sentence's meaning. I still feel like my interpretation makes more sense, except that Demons don't have combat gear.

"They" refers to some hypothesized central body of demonic government in charge of creating revenants out of dead demons, not the revenants themselves.



Hey, while we're nitpicking game manuals, I can't help but remember Duke3D's manual claiming such falsehoods as "enforcers drop armour" and "commanders drop rockets."

Here's another Quiz Question: What level from Doom or Doom 2 is paradoxically easier on Skill level Nightmare (the one that isn't even remotely fair) than it is on "easier" skill levels Ultra Violence, Hurt me Plenty and Hey, Not too Rough? Why?

Hellbent said:

Here's another Quiz Question: What level from Doom or Doom 2 is paradoxically easier on Skill level Nightmare (the one that isn't even remotely fair) than it is on "easier" skill levels Ultra Violence, Hurt me Plenty and Hey, Not too Rough? Why?

Isn't this pretty subjective? I mean...I might not be saying this if I knew the answer you were looking for, but it seems like not everybody would agree on what makes a level easier.

Hellbent said:

3. Statistically speaking, assuming your aim is perfect, shooting at the horde of specters on MAP19, The Citadel, up close with a shotgun, on Skill 4, would you be able to kill them all if you didn't have a backpack but you had max ammo? If not, how many would be left standing?
Assume your aim is so good that all shotgun pellets find their target.
HINT: the horde consists of 25 specters.

spoiler - highlight to read:

Spoiler

Myk is the only one to get it right with: "No, because you have two shots per spectre, and you need slightly more than two shots to kill each. A shot inflicts 70 points, and the monsters have 150. We can say two of the spectres would survive your attack, because you'd inflict 3500 points of damage against their 3750 hit points."

This has been bugging me for days, so I finally looked it up. The correct answer is actually 0. Demons/Spectres can be killed with two shots from the SG, and fairly frequently. One SG pellet does a maximum of 15hp damage and there are 7 pellets per shot, so the max damage is actually 105hp. For a hoarde of 25 Spectres, that leaves you with 1500hp to spare, assuming every pellet hits and does maximum damage.

I don't know what you're looking for here. Tower of Babel, because the lost souls' constant charging gets them stuck on rocket boxes? Grosse, because there's twice as much ammo to play with?

Andy Olivera said:

assuming every pellet hits and does maximum damage.

That isn't only unlikely, but actually impossible with Doom's system of pseudo-random number generation.