Most annoying moster...

[Kristian Ronge]

Graf Zahl said:
Die Hard 3 had a few supposedly 'German' lines that were completely incomprehensible. It makes me laugh every time I see that movie...

Yeah! Like that idiot trying to say "Sieht aus wie Fort Knox" and it ends up like "Zeeeet ahs ve fart naahks". :-) (It's the scene where they break into the vault and start throwing gold bullion at each other)

[SSWolfenSie]

I hate those monsters:
-Chaingunner: The sound of his chaingun is so suck...
-Pain Elemental: Blasts on my level tons of Lost Souls...
-Arch-Vile: Respawning the monsters I've killed...
-The Cyberdemon: 1. I gonna die so fast with his stupid rocket launcher.
2. he blasts you away so far...
3. I need to use 3 BFG shots to kill him (But if I use IDCLIP and I near him, I killing him in 2 BFG shoots.)


Suck stuff of those monsters...

[Graf Zahl]

Kristian Ronge said:

Yeah! Like that idiot trying to say "Sieht aus wie Fort Knox" and it ends up like "Zeeeet ahs ve fart naahks". :-) (It's the scene where they break into the vault and start throwing gold bullion at each other)

That's at least understandable. What about the scene with the two goons and the suitcase. Without the help of the subtitles I would have never understood what they are saying. It's utter gibberish.

[DooMBoy]

All of the Doom2 monsters are good if used CORRECTLY, but so many megawads (/me glares at HR2 and AV) like to send hordes and herds and packs of all the Doom2 monsters at you in such a way as to make them highly irritating and profanity inducing.
It's one thing to take on a couple Revenants in a hallway with an SSG, that I can stomach, but taking on an assload of chaingunners, Revenants and Pain Elementals (not to mention the rest of the cast and crew of both Doom games) in a wide open area is just....no. No one in their right mind (unless they are masochists) wants to play against such odds.

EDIT: And for the record, I think my least favorite monster in Doom2 is either the Painie, Chaingunner, or Revenant.

[Fredrik]

Obviously either the Arch-Vile or the Pain Elemental is the most annoying monster (depending on use). Not the worst though, that'd have to be the SS guy.

[Terra-jin]

The only monster I find annoying is the respawning monster. Other than that, I like them all :)

[LogicDeLuxe]

The worst German I ever noticed in a movie was in Indy3. "Fahrschein" and "Wand" are even completely missused. "Flugschein" and "Fels" would be appropriate in those particular scenes. Better don't watch Hollywood movies with Germans if you want lern German!

And for Wolfenstein 3D, there are also a lot of spelling and pronouncing errors. The frequently used low frequency of just 6000 Hz, which limits the bandwidth bellow telephone quality, makes them even more unrecognizable.

[dsm]

Ichor said:

The Nazi. Although they are good to be replaced with new monsters. Other than that, they are useless and terribly out of place.

Of course dumbo, they're supposed to be easter egg enemies :-P

Sheesh, why does everyone regard them as actual "serious" enemies? Commander Keen is probably even more useless.

Least fave is the Pain "In the Ass" Elemental despite the originality put into it. Gawd, that thing is just not fun at all to fight. The chaingunner at least you can take him down really quickly and avoid getting hit by if you use cover.

Oh but if you count Romero's severed brain case as an enemy, it'd definitely be on my top ten over worst Doom 2 enemies.

Heh, when I played Wolf3d with a sound card, I thought the SS guys were just laughing in a really retarded way. When I first played through map 31, I thought it sounded like they were saying "You're in trouble!" really fast.

"Oh? Let's see who's really in trouble around here, you fascist pig!" *Blammm!*

Oh and I thought their death phrases sounded like "Retrieve it!", which made nada sense of course.

[Ichor]

I wouldn't take Nazis so seriously if so many people didn't use them in their maps (except if they are Wolfenstein themed).

[dsm]

Ichor said:

I wouldn't take Nazis so seriously if so many people didn't use them in their maps (except if they are Wolfenstein themed).

Ah, but that's more the fault of the mappers rather than the enemy character itself, wouldn't you say?

They fit well as an easter egg in Doom 2, that's why I kinda like 'em.

But yes, it's annoying if you play a normal custom map and they're just thrown in there for kicks.

So um, wouldn't it be more fair to place the blame on mappers with a shitty sense of enemy choice rather than the poor li'l blue guys, hmmm?

[Ichor]

I suppose so, but then again, even the Pain Elemental can be fun and challenging if the mapmaker uses them correctly and doesn't go overboard (like in Doom 2 map 23 or maybe map 27).

[Raptor]

WTF IS the Revenant even in the game for? HES A SKELETON!! owww scarey hes just gona kill you in one shot with his 2 rocket launches!

[Ubik]

I don't think any of the Doom2 monsters are actually bad (except for when people try to use the SS guy as a "regular" enemy), but there are several of them that are really annoying:

-Pain Elementals: Either they waste your time and ammo by spitting out dozens of Lost Souls, or they end up being a simple, tedious case of charge-with-the-chainsaw (since it has no melee attack, it can't strike back). It's a good enemy when used properly, but otherwise it feels more like an irritating distraction than an actual enemy.

-Arch-Viles: The AV is actually a fairly well-designed enemy, but there are lots of situations where it simply feels like you're accomplishing absolutely nothing while wasting your time and effort. The satisfaction of killing a whole swarm of Barons and Revenants can go away in an instant when three Arch-Viles show up and undo most of your work, often behind your back as you're finishing other parts of the level. When it's loosed on a reasonable number of corpses with some cover around, it can be fun and challenging to fight; but if you just killed several dozen monsters and an Arch-Vile shows up with no shelter around to hide from its attack, it just becomes an insane irritant and no fun at all.

-Revenants: Their seeker rockets are just too much of a liability, especially when Revenants come at you in unreasonable swarms. Scrambling to find cover when two dozen rockets are following your every move is usually more of a hassle than it is enjoyable, unless there's sufficient cover and/or you can guide those rockets into other enemies to start infighting.

-Chaingunners: They're too easy to abuse, and can ruin a level pretty easily if somebody misuses them. It's tempting because they're physically small and weak, but have a dangerous, accurate hitscan weapon. I've seen too many cases where walls open and reveal a dozen chaingunners on each side that will almost instantly kill you; or instances where Chaingunners are on pillars or platforms high out of reach and simply chew on your health as you go around killing the other enemies.

-Cyberdemons: Just because they're so commonly misused. Their really high health makes them often boring to fight, and their rockets are strong enough that it can be very easy to use them badly.

Note that most of these instances of annoyance are due to bad mapping and enemy usage, rather than the enemies themselves. The enemies themselves work quite well as enemies, but the way they're constructed often makes them too easy to use really badly, which leads to the kind of complaints we've seen in this thread.

[Job]

What would you say is a proper way to use a pain elemental?

[Piezo]

DooMBoy said:

All of the Doom2 monsters are good if used CORRECTLY, but so many megawads (/me glares at HR2 and AV) like to send hordes and herds and packs of all the Doom2 monsters at you in such a way as to make them highly irritating and profanity inducing.
It's one thing to take on a couple Revenants in a hallway with an SSG, that I can stomach, but taking on an assload of chaingunners, Revenants and Pain Elementals (not to mention the rest of the cast and crew of both Doom games) in a wide open area is just....no. No one in their right mind (unless they are masochists) wants to play against such odds.

EDIT: And for the record, I think my least favorite monster in Doom2 is either the Painie, Chaingunner, or Revenant.

I like AV, but I played it in the easiest skill setting. HR2final however is about getting raped. I think it is really for the most highly skilled doomers, but I quit that on level 5. I liked the first Hell Revealed, though.

[Chopkinsca]

I can't say a single monster is annoying, as they all can be annoying if placed in just the right way.
Some are more easier to make annoying than others. Trying to make imps annoying is far more difficult than making pain elementals annoying.

Although the roaming sound for revenants annoy me. And their death sound also annoys me.

[Bashe]

Man, I wish there was a sniper rifle...

*Sees a chaingunner*
*Aims while zoomed*

KERPOW!

[chubberz]

for me it would have to be the demon.

They are just too "plain" because all they can do is bite you....but i guess that would make me hate the lost soul also ^ ^

(although the demon has a bad-ass death animation) :P

[sargebaldy]

Pain Elemental

the monster that's so annoying it gave the formerly loveable Lost Soul a bad wrap :( one of the reasons I prefer to map for Doom is because in Doom maps they don't feel annoying since you know they weren't just created out of nothingness. People tend not to take much satisfaction out of killing something that they think was just spawned out of nowhere.

The only Doom II monster that I actually like is the arachnotron, imo none of the others really fit the Doom theme at all, except of course the chaingunner, but they're very annoying themselves.

[Mivalekan]

The pistol zombie. omfg I dont have enough skill.

[Mr. NobodX]

THE DOOMGUY!!!!!

















Wait a minute...

[Grazza]

No, that's a good answer. The doomguy kills me quite a lot, and often there's no warning at all. Blam! - he puts a rocket into a wall right next to me, and that's that.

Oh, and pain elementals rule. It's one of the few monsters that can kill itself (by getting into a fight with its own lost souls), and it can be used to kill a boss brain. They can be useful in messy infights too. They have some weird properties - a PE can leave a corpse, and thus be resurrected as a ghost (or respawn on NM). PEs be a nuisance in Tyson demos though.

[Terra-jin]

The Lost Soul has the same property. I found that out on e2m2 when I lured the Lost Souls from the chainsaw-secret under the crushers there. When I checked back, the Lost Souls had not vanished, but were there as crushed corpses.

Refresh my memory - could the Lost Souls respawn if they were squished into a corpse? Before I started using ZDOOM, I vaguely recall the Lost Soul not having the countkill flag, thus being unable to respawn.

[Grazza]

Lost Souls lack respawn frames, and AFAIK that means they can never respawn.

[Cyb]

that floating eye with the green symbol; man I know those just kinda sit there and don't hurt you or anything, but they can't be killed and I don't trust 'em!

[Terra-jin]

The respawn frame is required for Arch-Vile resurrection, while the countkill flag determines whether the demon can respawn, but that can only occur when the demon's death state ends with a frame duration of -1.

[Job]

Heh, it'd be cool if it could be made so that bossess and archviles could be resurrected by archviles.

[Grazza]

Ah, so maybe crushed lost souls can respawn on NM one of the early engines (versions 1.2 and 1.4 maybe?) that counted them as kills.

[JacKThERiPPeR]

-The Arch-Viles
-The Chaingunners (in large groups)
-The Pain Elementals

[Lord_Andres]

My least fav monster is that anoyning chaingun guy you can't escape those bullets and he firers so bloody fast too, good thing is that he's not to hard to kill, my fav monster is the cyberdemon I love the sound of when he walks and the sound gets louder when he gets closer, gets pretty creppy when you'r low on ammo and health :)