So...about the disappearing corpses

Has anyone after all this time figured out how to disabled them so the corpses stay?

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You keep asking this question when, repeatedly, there is no reason for this answer to have changed simply by you asking it. No, nobody has found a magic value of some magic corpse timer value; probably assumes that the limitation is entirely technical, not physical. It is almost always a technical limitation.

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So they can bug out and make loud THUMPTHUMPTHUMPTHUMP noises, I guess.

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No one as far as I know has disabled the disappearing corpses.

Not that it was needed unless you like low frame rates.

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Can't you wait a few years for the next Doom, when hardware advances will presumably make it feasible for corpses to remain?

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I doubt that's possible, Because if corpses remain that's likely going to affect perfomance, I've seen that in many games, when multiple 3D Models are drawn all together in 1 area, Massive lag .

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DMGUYDZ64 said:

I doubt that's possible, Because if corpses remain that's likely going to affect perfomance, I've seen that in many games, when multiple 3D Models are drawn all together in 1 area, Massive lag .


Don't bother explaining it to him using technical terms and factual argumentation, he already asked the same question months before the game got released, received the same answers, refused to acknowledge reality, went into full denial mode, began arguing against users who presented didactic explanations, then promptly got shat upon for being a knobhead.

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victorboris1 said:

Don't bother explaining it to him using technical terms and factual argumentation, he already asked the same question months before the game got released, received the same answers, refused to acknowledge reality, went into full denial mode, began arguing against users who presented didactic explanations, then promptly got shat upon for being a knobhead.


If you're talking about me, then the reason why I'm doubting the whole "Technical limitation" argument because I haven't seen any hardcore physical proof since no one has ever done or tested out it before (Even though I doubt these tools to modify the game's scripts even exists at all) since I highly believe that these design decisions were entirely because of consoles (as far as the context of "Technical Limitations" goes) because if the game were for only PC, then the corpses would have most likely stayed.

That's why someone needs to find a way to disable the corpse timer to see whose theory is correct and it's the only way to find out till we know the facts through solid proof/evidence since either one of us could be wrong you know.

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You're taking infos from guys who already experienced the Issue, You know you basically contradict them, And no you won't get an evidence because nobody knows how the game scripts work and even if they do, They wouldn't risk getting banned on DRM just to provide a proof of something barely anybody asked for .

Now you should ask yourself why did the developers make corpses vanish in the first place if not everyone likes it ? Because they had to .

EDIT : Sure people can provide proof that Multiple models in 1 room on a High-end game engine can cause Perfomance issues, But nobody would like to go through all this big time-consuming trouble just for a silly FPS Drop that nobody wants/needs .

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Jannak said:

If you're talking about me, then the reason why I'm doubting the whole "Technical limitation" argument because I haven't seen any hardcore physical proof since no one has ever done or tested out it before (Even though I doubt these tools to modify the game's scripts even exists at all) since I highly believe that these design decisions were entirely because of consoles (as far as the context of "Technical Limitations" goes) because if the game were for only PC, then the corpses would have most likely stayed.

That's why someone needs to find a way to disable the corpse timer to see whose theory is correct and it's the only way to find out till we know the facts through solid proof/evidence since either one of us could be wrong you know.

None of this holds when you realise neither side can actually be proven directly. We can't prove it to be a technical limitation as much as you can't prove it can be changed.
However the issue is you posted this on Doomworld, which has a much higher technical user ratio than most internet forums about video games. A good handful of us have worked on all sorts of game engines and related software, so when we say "no seriously constantly allocating new memory objects in real time on a newer and more technically complicated game engine, instead of using heap memory or stale-object reconstruction, isn't a particularly good idea", we aren't lying to you. We actually know these things, likely because we have already done it ourselves.

Plus, I can't imagine rendering all these dynamic objects would be particularly cheap.

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At the very least it should be an option. I remember when Doom 3 came out, one of the first mods was to let the corpses stay. The first obviously was duct-tape.

And it really didn't affect my performance that much having the bodies stay. And I got a few laughs out of their ragdolls bouncing around if I shot the enemies on stairways or in doorways.

I know Doom 4 rendering is far more complicated than Doom 3, but it's an effect that shouldn't be walled off for PC users; I can understand the console idea of "EVERYTHING IS THE SAME". Which if you're primarily a console gamer is nice. Yes many people probably can't use it due to framerate issues, or increased usage of the CPU, RAM or VRAM, but it should be available; if only for the shits and giggles, or lulz if you prefer.

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Jaxxoon R said:

So they can bug out and make loud THUMPTHUMPTHUMPTHUMP noises, I guess.


Oh yes! This! So fucking annoying! So cheap!

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Enforcer said:

Oh yes! This! So fucking annoying! So cheap!


you sound overwelmingly happy about it though?

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And yet human corpses stayed in Rage, a game developed for an outdated consoles. I think that well known ragdoll dance was the main reason they decided to completely remove any corpse. BTW that ragdoll dance inherited from Rage, however in Rage it was very rare glitch)

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Only for bodies you haven't looted (f they could be). Although is such AI already spawned on map load or dynamically? Because the technical explanation will either be for one or the other.

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I agree with jello that non-disappearing corpses should be an option. Even if computers can't handle it now, I am certain PCs in the future will be able to handle it. Plus, it's fun to further disfigure the corpses after they die. It's just the little things that make games so much fun.

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doom_is_great said:

I agree with jello that non-disappearing corpses should be an option. Even if computers can't handle it now, I am certain PCs in the future will be able to handle it. Plus, it's fun to further disfigure the corpses after they die. It's just the little things that make games so much fun.


Rule #32: enjoy the little things.

In Soldier of Fortune 2 I always laughed when a corpse ragdolled and they were went into the floor with only their ass sticking out. Or if they ragdolled into a cart in the hospital level and jumped all over the place. Videogames are supposed to be about fun, and if a weird bug makes you laugh, well you're still having fun aren't you?

This whole "videogames are serious business" shit is getting out of hand. For the publishers, yes it's serious business when you put tens or hundreds of millions of dollars into a game. If you're a developer it's thousands of hours of your life spent making a game. If you're a consumer, it's your hard-earned money buying a console, or buying/building a PC to play these games. It's a whole lot of money, and invested time.

And the end result is something that hopefully lets you have a little fun. The fun gets lost behind all the moniez.

Edit: Back to my original thought:
I can't tell you how to play a game, but if you're playing a game and you kill an enemy, and it ragdolls into the rafters, spins around, and then clips into a crate and gets stuck, jittering and moving in a slow circle as you fire round after round into them, and you don't laugh your ass off... you're playing games wrong. They're not reality, they're supposed to be fun.

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Non-disappearing corpses are certainly a nostalgic turn on for me but, since backtracking isn't as big of a game play element, it's not entirely necessary beyond gruesome cosmetics.

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TAPETRVE said:

If Dark Souls can do it, then so can this game.


lol

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TAPETRVE said:

If Dark Souls can do it, then so can this game.

While that is absolutely not how game engines work in the slightest, there also something isn't quite correct about the Dark Souls part either as I've played it a couple of times and absolutely do not remember persistent corpses, its active enemy count is far lower, and the encounters are set up far differently.

Point being you've changed every possible variable.

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I still think it would be a good idea to have a number of corpses allowed until they start disappearing. I get not having every corpse remaining, but it would be nice if the last 4-5 guys you killed stuck around for a while before fading. It definitely adds immersion. Alternatively there could just be a 60 second timer or something until they fade - In my opinion, either one would be an improvement that still wouldn't really strain hardware.

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GoatLord said:

Can't you wait a few years for the next Doom, when hardware advances will presumably make it feasible for corpses to remain?

This is what I hoped too, back in 2004 when I played Doom 3.

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re:Dark Souls, it's worth pointing out that the games dynamically load and unload things into memory as you walk around, so corpses are still only temporarily persistent.

I can't recall offhand if they improved it for the later games in the series, but the gist is if you walk far away and come back without resting at a bonfire, you'll see the enemy's corpse in the spot they would've spawned, not where you killed them (i.e. the game just persists "this guy is dead" rather than the actual corpse itself).

I remember a few instances across the series where this can happens while the enemy is on-screen, so you turn the corner to see a guy suddenly falling down as if it had just died, right in front of you. :P

Take this as you will; mostly just posting because it's amusing.

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Xaser said:

re:Dark Souls, it's worth pointing out that the games dynamically load and unload things into memory as you walk around, so corpses are still only temporarily persistent.

I can't recall offhand if they improved it for the later games in the series, but the gist is if you walk far away and come back without resting at a bonfire, you'll see the enemy's corpse in the spot they would've spawned, not where you killed them (i.e. the game just persists "this guy is dead" rather than the actual corpse itself).

I remember a few instances across the series where this can happens while the enemy is on-screen, so you turn the corner to see a guy suddenly falling down as if it had just died, right in front of you. :P

Take this as you will; mostly just posting because it's amusing.


Haven't noticed this in both Bloodborne or Dark Souls 3, so I guess they improved it. I remember backtracking a complete (large) level in Bloodborne and every corpse was exactly where I killed it.

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Edward850 said:

While that is absolutely not how game engines work in the slightest, there also something isn't quite correct about the Dark Souls part either as I've played it a couple of times and absolutely do not remember persistent corpses, its active enemy count is far lower, and the encounters are set up far differently.

Point being you've changed every possible variable.


Both Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3 have a bigger active enemy count than Doom 2016, plus fully persistent corpses.

What you notice with both is that active enemys are for example rendered at a lower FPS regarding their animations when they are (very) far away, so it nearly looks like step motion, so basically some kind of animation level-of-detail depending on distance.

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