Is the BFG overrated?

[KVELLER]

Just now, j4rio said:

I don't think there is an equivalent capable of similar mass destruction in any fps up to date. 

The Cleric's Wraithverge in Hexen is pretty damn devastating as well.

[leodoom85]

BFG10K+Quad Damage.......another example of perfect massacre

[SaladBadger]

I actually really like the design of the BFG 9000. Maybe not it completely dwarfing the Plasma Rifle in terms of efficient cell usage, but the way the weapon itself is designed is actually really cool. I noticed a comment in the Doom source "//Spawn a BFG explosion on every monster in view". This seems like a very Bernd thing to write, but no, its there in the uncleaned Jaguar source.

 

Now, the BFG does not actually affect "every monster in view", but this seems to make it pretty apparent that the tracers coming from the player is 100% intentional. And honestly, the way this sort of thing works makes it pretty damn apparent what you'll hit. Imagine a cluster of monsters you fire the BFG into. It doesn't matter where the ball hits, if it hits and you have the monsters in the right place, you'll probably actually hit every monster on screen excepting the obscured ones (and even then they might get hit anyways if the stuff in front is squishy). Imagine if the traces came from the ball or it did just do a massive explosion. Misses would suddenly be 40 cells down the toilet, and you'd do barely anything. (not to say that there's something wrong with a superweapon you can miss on and use inefficiently)

 

I suspect the reason for the weirder aspects of it: it not turning with you are for balancing reasons. The designers might have realized if you fired the ball into a wall and turned around quickly, you'd turn the BFG into a super super plasma shotgun, which might be a bit much. To a more casual player, who may pump BFG shots into a crowd while watching them to ensure they hit, etc, it works out greatly, you can be confident what you'd hit, since it covers the whole screen area. The weird restrictions tame it though, making better use of it require a certain level of skill.

 

And well that's a stupid wall of text on why I think the BFG is cool, which is probably really stupid to post in this thread and is just more signs I have problems with my life. i've been wanting to make a thread writing up some of the stuff I've noticed with the BFG since I think its a real cool weapon design, but I guess this is good enough.

[Lila Feuer]

OP's handle is embarrassing.

[baja blast rd.]

Verdict: no.

 

 

[Voros]

4 hours ago, Phade102 said:

Considering the OP hasn't responded to any of the comments, i'm gonna say hes a troll.

Don't worry. He'll get back to us in 14 days.

[Combinebobnt]

2 hours ago, leodoom85 said:

BFG10K+Quad Damage.......another example of perfect massacre

oh so almost every skulltag deathmatch map... good one carnevil...

[GarrettChan]

16 minutes ago, rdwpa said:

Verdict: no.

Thumb up for how this map works.

 

@Fonze Is "Brexec" you were talking about a WAD? It seems I can't find it. Or any other suggestion for BFG practice? Much appreciated.

Edited June 12, 2017 by GarrettChan

[Doomkid]

It's a nickname for this compilation: http://www.doomshack.org/wads/execbrit10brit11.wad

 

You'll fine Exec+Brit on many online servers, it's pretty much known as the BFG spammer's paradise :P Really enjoyable though!

[GarrettChan]

3 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

It's a nickname for this compilation: http://www.doomshack.org/wads/execbrit10brit11.wad

Oh, I thought it's single player based. I don't really like multiplayer games though.

[ImpMan11203]

A good analogy to this thread would probably be, "is food overrated?"

[Fonze]

14 minutes ago, GarrettChan said:

Oh, I thought it's single player based. I don't really like multiplayer games though.

Nothing like some fast-paced DMs to gain a better familiarity with the weapons' strengths and weaknesses! Just gotta find a nice group of people to play with :)

[Unholypimp1n]

If anything I think the plasma rifle becomes useless once you get the bfg because then you will save cells just to use the bfg in a pinch and thus never use the plasma rifle again.  

[Lila Feuer]

9 minutes ago, Unholypimp1n said:

If anything I think the plasma rifle becomes useless once you get the bfg because then you will save cells just to use the bfg in a pinch and thus never use the plasma rifle again.  

It's definitely way lower on my priority list to use once I have a weapon that can one-two shot all enemies in the game at point blank range, but someone around here described it as a 'panic weapon' to have out when exploring an unknown area. I like that.

[Battle_Korbi]

The BFG isn't, but SSG surely is. In a lot of dm servers, players always pick these lances up and charge, probably thinking "if I get the BFG I will surely get rekt by some camper", and much like the four monkeys and a banana experiment, no one dares to run for that gun, only pick it up so that the other guy doesn't use it. Of course, I get to pick it up and use some 1337 strats that would pick up a lot of frags in no time.

 

Also, apparently SSG "dwarfs" any other weapon as well. I have yet to see someone with a chaingun or a plasma gun, or a regular shotgun even. No wonder I had quit multiplayer. The elitism is kind off bothering me. Yeah, I used the chaingun and the regular shotgun, but no one else did, and the whole charade turned out to be a predictable session of who lances who with a SSG.

 

I mean, it is not even that nice in singleplayer. Yeah it kills stuff instantly, yeah it uses merely two shells at the time, but that kinda negates the fun of the game and replaces it with cheap thrills of "is that pinky going to bite me during reloads?" and "eat lead scum!", while every other weapon is really fun to use. Even the fists sometimes.

 

Tl;dr no fucking tl;dr read this shit :DDDDDD

[Graf Zahl]

The BFG9000 is to this day one of the very few 'big guns' in computer games that actually work as advertised.

 

Most of the times they are mere gimmicks - and sometimes - just look at Hexen, rendered utterly pointless by some restrictions being coded in. The Wraithverge, for example would be something comparable to the BFG in terms of destructiveness, if it didn't come with one caveat that renders it one of the least useful weapons ever: If you hit a monster that can reflect attacks back to the attacker, you are toast. Just too bad that one of Hexen's minor monsters and one of the bosses are of that kind... :(

 

And something similar goes for most other big weapons as well, I'll make an exception for Quake 2's BFG10k which ultimately just copied from Doom, though.

 

[geo]

BFG overayted. it balanses bad lvl design from bad lvl makers that think its cool when you put 80+ monsters in 1 room since there r no lifes. without it there wood b real lvls that r good and not terry inspiration.

[Memfis]

7 hours ago, InsanityBringer said:

I suspect the reason for the weirder aspects of it: it not turning with you are for balancing reasons.

I think it was simply easier to program it this way.

[ShoDemo]

It can kill a Spider Mastermind in 2 shots (rarely at even one), which is Doom 1's final boss I shall remind you. And with one or two well placed shots, you can surely clear out a room of certain dimensions, from enemy presence. Additionally, the Cyberdemon can also be killed in two to three shots. If killing those two monsters, that rule Hell itself, isn't enough to qualify the BFG, as one of the greatest weapons in gaming history (or the best, for that matter), then I don't know what is. So, I find the BFG to be The Gun of guns.

 

[dew]

hardcore_gamer: BFG is overrated, because it's weaker than PG when I use it like the PG. What is tracer damage.

Memfis: BFG is overrated, because it's too op and boring. I avoid it to find excitement in this hollow existence, sigh.

 

If we remove the parts that contradict each other, we're left with "BFG is overrated". Checkmate, atheists.

[Ichor]

3 hours ago, Graf Zahl said:

The BFG9000 is to this day one of the very few 'big guns' in computer games that actually work as advertised.

 

Most of the times they are mere gimmicks - and sometimes - just look at Hexen, rendered utterly pointless by some restrictions being coded in. The Wraithverge, for example would be something comparable to the BFG in terms of destructiveness, if it didn't come with one caveat that renders it one of the least useful weapons ever: If you hit a monster that can reflect attacks back to the attacker, you are toast. Just too bad that one of Hexen's minor monsters and one of the bosses are of that kind... :(

 

The centaurs/slaughtaurs will only reflect those ghosts if their shields are up when the initial HolyMissile hits them before it splits up. They won't reflect the actual ghosts. The heresiarch though...yeah, he will reflect everything. Also, the ghosts burn out quicker when they're attacking bosses anyway.

[Zulk RS]

Seeing as how it's the 2nd strongest most useful weapon in all the games I've played... No. It's not overrated.

[KVELLER]

3 hours ago, Graf Zahl said:

The Wraithverge, for example would be something comparable to the BFG in terms of destructiveness, if it didn't come with one caveat that renders it one of the least useful weapons ever: If you hit a monster that can reflect attacks back to the attacker, you are toast. Just too bad that one of Hexen's minor monsters and one of the bosses are of that kind... :(

It might not be as useful as the BFG, but I'd say it's for its own good. I was really dissapointed when I saw the Spider Mastermind going down with two shots. I mean, come on, it's the game's final boss!

 

The Heresiarch and Korax at least are able to put a fight even with the best weapons available.

[SaladBadger]

2 hours ago, Memfis said:

I think it was simply easier to program it this way.

Not really, it would involve adding ->target to a single line. the developers at id, while certainly not accounting for everything in their design, weren't entirely stupid and could probably see when obvious exploits would be possible, such as doing a 180 right after firing a bfg shot into a wall. I mean they were fully aware of the silent BFG trick, according to the BFG faq, and Carmack is credited by Petersen as devising the rocket jump on e3m6 (makes one wonder why they didn't think about rocket jumping in quake...)

[Koko Ricky]

The BFG is like every weapon in Doom: It takes some finesse to make good use of. It can be a real lifesaver in sticky situations, but it requires careful consideration both of your capacity to stay within visible range of the target, and how many enemies are clustered together, and of what varieties. With good timing and aiming, nothing is more powerful.

[Arctangent]

To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just an oversight that it used the ball's angle instead of your's.

[Memfis]

If it was made to follow your angle, would you be able to damage more monsters by turning around very quickly, therefore changing (expanding?) the angle during the attack? Or is everything released, like, instantly?

[HavoX]

To say that the BFG is overrated, is quite an overstatement. The key to using it is when you should be using it. Waste not! (hint-hint!)

 

26 minutes ago, Arctangent said:

To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just an oversight that it used the ball's angle instead of your's.

yours

 

[Cruduxy Pegg]

I like french fries but I prefer my ketchup without them.
 

[SaladBadger]

38 minutes ago, Memfis said:

If it was made to follow your angle, would you be able to damage more monsters by turning around very quickly, therefore changing (expanding?) the angle during the attack? Or is everything released, like, instantly?

Every tracer is fired in the same tic, so you can't expand it. If you could control it by turning, you'd only be able to control the cone's overall facing.

 

I guess saying the cone intentionally facing the projectile to prevent exploits is a bit of a stretch, for every rocket jump they devised and silent bfg trick they picked up on, they also missed things like two independent sources of thrust adding up to make a stronger overall thrust giving you straferunning, or archviles throwing you upwards to reach higher points, and many others.